Speed Issues

When ordering broadband from orange I was told I would be getting 16 meg due to the 21 cn technology and it was showing up on the BT website.
Since my broadband being activated the speed showing on my router (netgear dgn 1000) has been around 6.8 to 7.2mb download and 1.0 to 1.2 mb upload with a line attenuation of 32db and a noise margin of 6.5-7db. I have used thishttp://www.kitz.co.uk/adsl/max_speed_calc.php
and it is showing that i should be getting around 14mb.

I have been on the phone for the last month or so and everytime I have been put through all sorts of tests, the last being to connect my router to the test socket which I have been advised to do by a level 2 engineer who said that if my speed doesn`t increase to around 14mb I should call them back. I did the test and it never improved, I called them back and to my amazement they started telling me that my line can only support 6mb max. My max speed on the Bt Broadband checker has changed as well from the original 16mb to 6mb

Andrew replied me by email

The attenuation suggests the line can go faster, but the other data you�ve given show no signs that Orange are holding you back, i.e. the issue may simply be noise on your phone wiring.

When using the test socket what are the attenuation, connection speed and noise figures? Also when using the test socket, check that NONE of the phones in the house work.

Speedtest results take some time to improve, thus it is important to get the stats direct from the modem, and if better in time the results will improve.

The Checker updates automatically to reflect what your line is doing, i.e. feedback loop.

The sales estimates are just estimates and until hardware is plugged into a line, anything will be an estimate, or put another way a best guess.

Andrew

Thanks for the quick reply Andrew.

Just wanted to also point out that they connected a new line to my house , new bt socket and the engineer changed the line which connects to the street (the black one).

When using the test socket it gave me a speed of 7mb and the line attenuation was 32db but the noise was 7db. I have only one BT socket which I use to connect the the phone and modem too. by other data do you mean the noise Margin? one point worth to consider is that some people in my area are getting over 10mb.As I said the attenuation isn`t that high and the noise isn`t that bad so why am I still getting low speeds?

When talking to an engineer the guy mentioned to me that before Orange used to put people on 14mb straight away but now what they are doing is putting people on a lower speed and increasing it.

Sky start with slow speeds and rise.

Orange who is ran by BT Wholesale in broadband terms, start high and go low, by raising target noise margin. The putting people onto 14 Mbps right away is wrong, since for over 90% of people this would mean no connection at all.

Can you post the exact figures, and seeing both the upstream and downstream information at the same time is useful. It is also not unknown for people to post the wrong figures, or even the modem to have them the wrong way around.

Exact figures are important as you can spot common numbers sometimes, and see if its a fixed speed setting that is being used.

Also worth trying a different modem e.g. borrow a friends of a different model.

Modem Netgear DGN1000
ADSL Firmware Version 3.4.4.0.0.1
Modem Status Connected
DownStream Connection Speed 7224 Kbps
UpStream Connection Speed 1127 Kbps
VPI 0
VCI 38


ADSL Link Downstream Upstream
Connection Speed 7224 Kbps 1127 Kbps
Line Attenuation 32.1 dB 15.1 dB
Noise Margin 7.7 dB 5.8 dB

BT test below
Download speedachieved during the test was - 5875 Kbps
For your connection, the acceptable range of speeds is 2000-7150 Kbps.
IP Profile for your line is - 6373 Kbps
Note: An Upstream test was not conducted on this line due to a technical issue. If your concern is related to upstream performance then please retry
the performance test again in 1 hours time.

thinkbroadband test result
Date 29/09/11 15:02:21
Speed Down 6001.79 Kbps ( 5.9 Mbps )
Speed Up 931.16 Kbps ( 0.9 Mbps )
Port 8095
Server speedtest2.thinkbroadband.com

Okay figures look good, just slow for that attenuation.

No suggestion that the line is being held back artificially speed wise, a possibility is that your modem is only connecting in ADSL mode.

In the routers web interface, there should be a ADSL Settings menu, with a DSL Mode, switch this from Auto to ADSL2+ mode and see what happens. If after a few minutes the modem has not connected then the inference is that you are on the 21CN network, but the ISP/BT Wholesale is limiting you to use the ADSL protocol.

it is connected and below are the stats from the router

Connection Speed 7864 Kbps 1139 Kbps
Line Attenuation 32.1 dB 15.1 dB
Noise Margin 6.0 dB 5.9 dB

on the page that you said to change the options, it is now as below


Multiplexing Method VC-Based
VPI 0
VCI 38
DSL Mode adsl2+

I am still checking and everywhere I`m putting those figures it is suggesting that I should be getting more. Even the BT Engineer who installed the BT socket said to me that I should be getting very fast speed as it is a new connection but how come it is still the same speed?

On pingtest it says that my line`s quality is A
Ping 12ms
Jitter 3ms
packet loss 0%

Edited by deleted (Thu 29-Sep-11 15:47:37)

Ok so different speed, so they've not fixed your speed.
Also ADSL2+ made some difference it appears (not 100% sure but may have).

Suggestion then is that your telephone line has more noise on it than others in the area, it is a decent length that would get the speed suggested at signup, but the level of noise locally is not helping.

Now this might be a factor of how the phone line was connected. Always worth finding out what immediate (and I mean next door not a few doors down) are getting stats wise.

I live in the corner of a street in a 1 bed house, before(3 months ago) I used to be living across but I know for a fact that line wasn`t perfect. On pingtest it was giving me a result of C and above (please check the above edited post where I have put a ping test result.

What do you mean by how the phone line was connected? When the engineer came, he changed the whole filter and he changed that black wire which connects to the BT pole outside of my house. Any other test you suggest I should do?

In reply to a post by Shehzu:

My max speed on the Bt Broadband checker has changed as well from the original 16mb to 6mb

Yes, the BT Availability Checker only shows what your ISP claims/thinks you line is capable of, not what it actually can do. My estimated speed there and at Orange is only 13 Meg (down from 16 Meg when I was on LLU) but my line is consistently syncing at 18.5 - 19 Meg.

In reply to a post by andrew:

The Checker updates automatically to reflect what your line is doing, i.e. feedback loop.

No, there is no evidence of auto feedback! It somehow reflects what the ISP claims; see above.

I suspect that you are actually running on "up to 8 Meg" ADSL(1).

Can you try to login to your router at this link: http://192.168.0.1/setup.cgi?PATH=/bin:/sbin:/usr/bi... (if your router supports it and has its default IP as here) and read off the resultant "Mode:" entry?

nopes.am using chrome and it says no data.cant access the link my router is dgn1000. i told orange of me being on up to 8 meg but they say no i`m on 21cn.what else do u suggest i can do?

The BT checker generally (not always) does update to reflect the MSR as presented at the end of the 10 day period.
In some cases it does not seem to.

It may also be the estimate was a postcode one, and now the line is active they have taken the actual sync speed. I stand by my feedback comments, which are based on previous conversations with BT Wholesale

21CN is a marketing name.

Within the WBC product the ISP can limit you to different products, or cap the speed.

The fact you synced using ADSL2+ mode, suggests ASDL only is not forced on the line.
The differing sync speeds suggest no speed cap.

Ruling out noise as an influence would be the next thing to do, along with trying a different modem.

Browser should make no diff; it's just a URL. But it might depend on router. Can you do it using TELNET as described here: http://www.kitz.co.uk/routers/netgeardg834_interleav... (maybe like DGN2000)?

Never believe Support unless you can confirm it yourself

All my estimates are based on line # not postcode and have not reflected actual syncs since I went on WBC in April.

As a point of interest my 2nd non-BB line estimates at 17.5 Meg, which agrees with speeds I once had on it during a month's free trial with O2 LLU, as well as my actual BB line.

I don't doubt what you are seeing, just that it cannot be extrapolated to be the case for all lines.

No, but it casts doubts on any expectation that the BT Checker tracks actual speeds eventually. The only foolproof method is "to suck it and see" if it reflects what you are actually getting.

In reply to a post by MrSaffron:

Ruling out noise as an influence would be the next thing to do, along with trying a different modem.

What would be the normal level and how to reduce it? Do I have to do anything with the filter?Saw a troubleshooting guide on the web something to do with the wires inside.

Edited by deleted (Thu 29-Sep-11 20:52:28)

In reply to a post by XRaySpeX:

Can you do it using TELNET

Cannot telnet on dgn1000 any other way ?

In reply to a post by Shehzu:

In reply to a post by XRaySpeX:

Can you do it using TELNET

Cannot telnet on dgn1000 any other way ?

You've already posted the info here:

In reply to a post by Shehzu:

DSL Mode adsl2+

I don't think so, That's a request setting, not an actual status.

It's still worth verifying if at all possible.

Edited by XRaySpeX (Fri 30-Sep-11 01:42:02)

In reply to a post by Shehzu:

any other way ?

What's the LAN IP of your router? Is it diff from the usual 192.168.0.1 ?

As the modem sync'd in ADSL2+ mode, when on an old IPStream ADSL only you try this it will refuse to sync at all.

In reply to a post by XRaySpeX:

In reply to a post by Shehzu:

any other way ?

What's the LAN IP of your router? Is it diff from the usual 192.168.0.1 ?

usual 192.168.0.1

The router doesn`t support telnet

connection is on 2.5mb now.pfffffffffffffffffffff

Any other suggestions guys?

Shehzu, as you have read on other posts, I am also having problems with speed on Orange where mine starts off good in the morning and drops throughout the day to below 4mb in the evening then comes back up again around midnight-ish.

I've found Tech Support to be rubbish so ended up going through Customer Services, advising them I'm having speed issues and Tech Support are not helping and threatened to ask for my MAC code if something wasn't done. I was then put through to their Level 3 Support (based in UK). They've been more helpful in the last 24 hours than the Tech Support Team have been in a week.

In my case, I've been told there is not a fault on BT's end but there is a critical issue within Orange's system/network giving poor service throughput - giving the speed drops throughout the day. I have to wait until my speed drops below 4mb then do another Tap1 and Tap3 test via the BT Speedtester. Once that has been done, I cannot do another BT Speedtest as it will wipe the Tap1/Tap3 data from Orange's systems. The chap is keeping an eye out for the data to come through and then he is forwarding it to their Critical 'something-or-other' Team so they can investigate further. He couldn't advise me if it was a national or local fault at this time but is aware of other people having similar problems.

It may be worth going through Customer Services like me if you're having no joy with Tech Support.

Oh, and Orange Tech Support told me a few days ago that my line will only support 2mb - strange when I've just managed to clock this ....



But guaranteed, my speed will drop again

Edited by deleted (Fri 07-Oct-11 14:20:52)

In reply to a post by jinger:

Shehzu, as you have read on other posts, I am also having problems with speed on Orange where mine starts off good in the morning and drops throughout the day to below 4mb in the evening then comes back up again around midnight-ish.

I've found Tech Support to be rubbish so ended up going through Customer Services, advising them I'm having speed issues and Tech Support are not helping and threatened to ask for my MAC code if something wasn't done. I was then put through to their Level 3 Support (based in UK). They've been more helpful in the last 24 hours than the Tech Support Team have been in a week.

In my case, I've been told there is not a fault on BT's end but there is a critical issue within Orange's system/network giving poor service throughput - giving the speed drops throughout the day. I have to wait until my speed drops below 4mb then do another Tap1 and Tap3 test via the BT Speedtester. Once that has been done, I cannot do another BT Speedtest as it will wipe the Tap1/Tap3 data from Orange's systems. The chap is keeping an eye out for the data to come through and then he is forwarding it to their Critical 'something-or-other' Team so they can investigate further. He couldn't advise me if it was a national or local fault at this time but is aware of other people having similar problems.

It may be worth going through Customer Services like me if you're having no joy with Tech Support.

Oh, and Orange Tech Support told me a few days ago that my line will only support 2mb - strange when I've just managed to clock this ....



But guaranteed, my speed will drop again

can you post your router stats here please , attenuation etc... how are you clocking 12mb? is that your normal speed?