Any Plusnet FTTC 'cheaper' deals???

I have been on Plusnet FTTC broadband unlimited ONLY (i.e. phone still with BT and I wanted to keep it this way) for just over 18 months and paying 19.99 UKPs/month for it! I'm getting roughly 51Mbps download and 13Mbps upload and I'm happy with it regarding its reliability. etc However, is there any scopes of getting a "cheaper deals" for it with Plusnet Broadband only such as re-signing up for another Contract/s etc????

Thanks

You'll only know for sure by phoning PN and asking to speak to the "customer options team", for sure you will be offered a discount for moving the line rental over to them but you might get a discount for say taking out a longer contract than usual or even just staying with them for another 18 months instead of moving to another ISP, suggest you are considering a move because of the cost involved with staying with PN.

not bein funny here,so please don't take ofence Plusnet are cheap at £19.99 per month when you take into account what BT openreach charge isp's each month for FTTC rental assuming that plusnet aren't able to get a discount by buying in bulk
They are actually providing FTTC at a loss thats before they purchase bandwidth ect ,

?
Plusnet at £19.99 including Vat is £16.66 net + £3.33 Vat. The Openreach monthly charge to them for the 80/20 product is £9.95. Gross profit £6.71pm.

Well it was a dam sight more in the bt document that i read around iirc was around £260 per annum Just checked again and it's showing as £119.40 per anum as at 10/04/2012 so as you say £9.95 per month can't find the document which said it was more ,

Factor in the wbc costs too

Even if you add VAT and WLR line rental to GEA-FTTC, it doesn't come to £260 per year. Of course, Plusnet have to cover all their other costs including backhaul, peering and so on within that £6.67. It's not exactly a huge margin.

So still could be running at a loss on the FTTC products but they are relying on making profits from ,wlr and calls and TV packages

which could account for the way they advertise promote bb & phone deals over bb only, But by giving away 6mths free or half priced bb, and significant cashbacks will eat away at their profit margins, something has to be cut in order for them to be in buisness
Could be some milage why the peak time issues reported by some customers haven't been sorted out yet ??? and as to why they have peak time issues in the first place, they do unfortunately appear to be more focused on the quantity rather than quality

Edited by tommy45 (Sun 01-Feb-15 20:18:18)

In reply to a post by RobertoS:

?
Plusnet at £19.99 including Vat is £16.66 net + £3.33 Vat. The Openreach monthly charge to them for the 80/20 product is £9.95. Gross profit £6.71pm.

Plusnet don't buy from Openreach - check the BT Wholesale WBC price list.

Standard EU Rental (FTTC 80Mbps Downstream, 20Mbps Upstream) N/A 11/04/2012 Month £16.00

In reply to a post by Ignitionnet:

In reply to a post by RobertoS:

?
Plusnet at £19.99 including Vat is £16.66 net + £3.33 Vat. The Openreach monthly charge to them for the 80/20 product is £9.95. Gross profit £6.71pm.

Plusnet don't buy from Openreach - check the BT Wholesale WBC price list.

Standard EU Rental (FTTC 80Mbps Downstream, 20Mbps Upstream) N/A 11/04/2012 Month £16.00

Also worth noting for
CP Migration (BTW CP - BTW CP FTTC to FTTC) &CP Migration (Openreach CP - BTW CP FTTC to FTTC) 1 month contract term FEE £11.00 So far not one (to my knowlage) ISP has started to pass this saving on to the End users to those migrations that qualify,*( EU has had previously has a FTTC service for 12mths or over) which was delayed back in July last year but has been live since november 2014
*ISP's aren not under any obligation to pass these savings on to end users , so a tad pointless ofcom asking BT OR to do this

Edited by tommy45 (Sun 01-Feb-15 21:19:02)

In reply to a post by RobertoS:

?
Plusnet at £19.99 including Vat is £16.66 net + £3.33 Vat. The Openreach monthly charge to them for the 80/20 product is £9.95. Gross profit £6.71pm.

So Plusnet are rip off then? Charged customer £10.04 extra a month (a nice £180.72 profit for Plusnet in a 18 months contract)

God, I hate ISP who ripped us off.

If Openreach saying £9.95 per month then PLusnet should sold it as £9.95 a month not £19.99.

No they have to buy from BT wholesale the BT openreach prices are for ISP's like Sky and TT who have their own LLU kit in exchanges Zen orders from both as they have some exchanges enabled ,

Plusnet don't buy from Openreach - check the BT Wholesale WBC price list.

Standard EU Rental (FTTC 80Mbps Downstream, 20Mbps Upstream) N/A 11/04/2012 Month £16.00

add to this bandwith costs from BTW and other networking costs such as peering then staff wages

But they do make a heathly profit on long contracts and install fees on incoming CP Migration (BTW CP - BTW CP FTTC to FTTC) &CP Migration (Openreach CP - BTW CP FTTC to FTTC) BTW now charge £11.00 for those migrations, and there is now a 1 mth min term to cp's/isp's on qualifying FTTC migrations, and then there is WLR3 + calls calling plans they make most of their profits from this and are used to subsidise the monthly bb fees

Edited by tommy45 (Mon 02-Feb-15 21:47:55)

I think Plusnet are probably the only ISP (they have no LLU network) to pass on some savings they get to the end user with their "low cost" area pricing for their BB products are they not?

In reply to a post by adslmax:

So Plusnet are rip off then? Charged customer £10.04 extra a month (a nice £180.72 profit for Plusnet in a 18 months contract)

Mixing up Vat inclusive prices and Vat exclusive prices is not valid Max.

Businesses pay supplier price + Vat to their suppliers and charge their marked-up price + Vat to their customers. If my figures had been right the gross profit is as I posted.

Each supplier in the chain sells at (cost + markup) x Vat rate. Each pays HMRC their Output Vat minus their Input Vat. At each step in the chain. As a result, at each step in the chain a business pays HMRC the Vat on its markup, in other words it pays tax on the value (price) it has added.

That's why it is called Value Added Tax.

God, I hate ISP who ripped us off.

Think about that too Max . If amongst BT Wholesale-based ISPs Plusnet is almost the cheapest, how can they possibly be ripping us off? I suggest any ISP with a lower markup is at risk of going bust.

If Openreach saying £9.95 per month then PLusnet should sold it as £9.95 a month not £19.99.

That's even dafter! Who pays for the backhaul, as already mentioned? Who pays for the Plusnet routers, sales and support staff, office space rent and rates, heating and lighting, and so on and so on? That all comes out of the gross profit figure of the (fictional) transaction being discussed.

Not forgetting they are one of the most expensive on a Market 1 exchange.

In reply to a post by professor973:

Not forgetting they are one of the most expensive on a Market 1 exchange.

I wasn't aware of that are you sure?

My exchange is 20CN mkt 1 no LLU thought PN pricing and usage allowance was pretty good compared to many other ISP's.

I'm sure - been there and got the T-shirt. See Fuel or EE broadband or Zen line rental. I am paying £6 line rental with Pulse8, a company that have no contract tie-in even for fibre and the lowest call rates. PN near enough as expensive as BT at £38 per month on Market 1. There are better deals with no contract tie-in.

Edited by professor973 (Thu 05-Feb-15 13:24:28)

Their small print suggests that the £6 line rental is only available if you take Pulse8 XL broadband at the same time.

Still cheap for market 1 areas, but the line rental to broadband tie-in is worth noting, as some might presume you can get the £6 deal when taking broadband elsewhere.

Line rental is £13 per month if you don't take their broadband.

Quite correct, but still far cheaper line rental than just about any supplier and no 18 month contract tie-in even for fibre which includes line rental (In the small print)! £25 for BB & Line is on a par with EE which is considered cheap - After all, it's not as if we can have Broadband without line rental.

Edited by professor973 (Thu 05-Feb-15 13:36:01)

Plans are progressing to offer FTTC without line rental, i.e. no voice support at all - a work in progress.

That doesn't make Plusnet "one of the most expensive on a Market 1 exchange". It only makes Pulse8 possibly by far the cheapest.

You are being unrealistic if you expect facts to get in the way of an opportunity to have a pop at Plusnet!

For me Pulse8 BB and line rental for the 20CN connection would be a minmum of £28 for BB and £13 for line rental.

Pulse8 BB is available at monthly cost of £28 or £30 or £36 with "Unlimited High priority 20:1 (IP Stream) ADSL broadband"

Seems expensive at first glance.

In reply to a post by Apprentice:

For me Pulse8 BB and line rental for the 20CN connection would be a minmum of £28 for BB and £13 for line rental.

Pulse8 BB is available at monthly cost of £28 or £30 or £36 with "Unlimited High priority 20:1 (IP Stream) ADSL broadband"

Seems expensive at first glance.

Not sure where you get your figures from. Pulse8 line rental comes down to £6 if you take broadband from them and Broadband is from £19. Set against the high cost of compulsory line rental and long contract tie-in of others, I don't see it as expensive. Add the near £8 Market 1 penalty and Plusnet line Broadband and calls comes out at £38 for ADSL2+. I can get fibre for that, again with no contract. Yes, there is 'Free' Broadband out there, with long contracts, router and setup charges, high priced calls and call setup charges etc, so you pays your money and takes your choice.
http://www.pulse8broadband.co.uk/

In reply to a post by professor973:

In reply to a post by Apprentice:

For me Pulse8 BB and line rental for the 20CN connection would be a minmum of £28 for BB and £13 for line rental.

Pulse8 BB is available at monthly cost of £28 or £30 or £36 with "Unlimited High priority 20:1 (IP Stream) ADSL broadband"

Seems expensive at first glance.

Not sure where you get your figures from. Pulse8 line rental comes down to £6 if you take broadband from them and Broadband is from £19. Set against the high cost of compulsory line rental and long contract tie-in of others, I don't see it as expensive. Add the near £8 Market 1 penalty and Plusnet line Broadband and calls comes out at £38 for ADSL2+. I can get fibre for that, again with no contract. Yes, there is 'Free' Broadband out there, with long contracts, router and setup charges, high priced calls and call setup charges etc, so you pays your money and takes your choice.
http://www.pulse8broadband.co.uk/

Although cheaper the FTTC products are not unlimited , 100gb for £38.00 no point in having FTTC with such a tiny usesage cap

For a connection from a 20CN exchange (no LLU) the BB products available are:-

http://s11.postimg.org/3my82zkj7/Pule8_BB_via_20_CN_...

Line rental bundle at £6.00 a month only applies when bundled with Pulse8 XL BB on the same line, unfortunately it isn't available with the BB packages from a 20CN exchange hence the £13.00 month line rental.

http://s30.postimg.org/cvm7hoccx/Pulse8_Line_Rental_...

For anyone who is on a Market 1 exchange with TalkTalk Wholesale available Pulse look very attractive - especially if you are paying the extra £7.83 Plusnet charge for Max Premium so you can get a half decent upload speed!

Also I don't think IPStream still exists, having been replaced by IPStream Connect. There is certainly no 20:1 ratio in the BT Wholesale system any more.

Please note: we are retiring BT IPstream ADSL and SDSL services nationally. All IPstream end user circuits, in retiring exchanges where Wholesale Broadband Connect (WBC) is enabled, must be migrated prior to the exchange retirements which are taking place between late 2013 and summer 2014. Any other remaining end user circuits must be migrated prior to the retirement of BT Centrals on 31 July 2014. A copy of the exchange list showing dates of the exchange retirement can be found on the IPstream Price List page. The IPstream Connect product will remain available in areas where there is no WBC footprint.

I think any one on a market 1 exchance with any LLU supplier retail or wholesale via a reseller would be cheaper than BTW based bb &line rental

this website is a mix of good and bad for me.

They seem to be more honest in regards to the all inclusive cost. ie, the phone line cost isnt on a separate page or small print.

On the other hand they not complying with the marketed speed from the ASA, they advertising 24mbit for adsl and 80mbit for FTTC.

Edited by Chrysalis (Fri 06-Feb-15 09:56:15)

In reply to a post by Chrysalis:

this website is a mix of good and bad for me.

They seem to be more honest in regards to the all inclusive cost. ie, the phone line cost isnt on a separate page or small print.

On the other hand they not complying with the marketed speed from the ASA, they advertising 24mbit for adsl and 80mbit for FTTC.

Totally agree, though there are many that offer '24mb', so is the 16mb thingy just a guide or law of the land, as it certainly is not enforced. That said, how many folks are not aware that speed will depend on distance from exchange or cabinet. Just in case anyone does click on a product, it is in front of their eyes in print. For me, I am just glad to find another provider with no tie-in whatsoever and a reasonable monthly bottom line, however it is arrived at. So far, customer service has been excellent, which is the test of if I stay, as the rest of the product is my choice. http://www.pulse8broadband.co.uk/broadband-packages?...

Edited by professor973 (Fri 06-Feb-15 15:36:15)

In reply to a post by professor973:

Totally agree, though there are many that offer '24mb', so is the 16mb thingy just a guide or law of the land, as it certainly is not enforced.

I've just let the ASA know, so we shall see how well it is enforced.

Of course, it's legal if 10% of their customers achieve it.

Edit - Got the figure wrong - D'oh!

Edited by RobertoS (Fri 06-Feb-15 23:08:53)

In reply to a post by RobertoS:

Of course, it's legal if 80% of their customers achieve it.

80%? It's 10%.

Extremely unlikely that 10% or more of their customers get 24,000 kbps on ADSL2+, but if they can prove to ASA that they do then they will be complying.

In reply to a post by RobertoS:

Of course, it's legal if 80% of their customers achieve it.

It's 'legal' anyway. The ASA has no regulatory or legislative power. About the worst it can do is report an offense to Ofcom.

it has no direct power but ofcom will enforce ASA breaches.

it is possible as olivier said they actually have 10% of customers achieving 24000kbps on adsl2+ but I think its very unlikely. They would only achieve that if they were rejecting poor lines.

really tho what I would like to see is similiar to what they done to the tesco regulator. Give ASA the ability to fine companies a certain % of revenue. Once it hurts their bottom line they will change.

Edited by Chrysalis (Fri 06-Feb-15 21:36:46)

Brainfade .

Thanks.

In reply to a post by Oliver341:

In reply to a post by professor973:

Totally agree, though there are many that offer '24mb', so is the 16mb thingy just a guide or law of the land, as it certainly is not enforced.

I've just let the ASA know, so we shall see how well it is enforced.

Hope you have mentioned all the other. Wouldn't want this place biased would we.

If you want to ensure equal treatment you are free to report the others yourself. After all we know you are always in favour of fair and unprejudiced treatment of all ISPs.

In reply to a post by jelv:

If you want to ensure equal treatment you are free to report the others yourself. After all we know you are always in favour of fair and unprejudiced treatment of all ISPs.

That is typical of the ignorance I have come to expect fro the likes of you here.

Sorry, I apologise for assuming that you are always in favour of fair and unprejudiced treatment of all ISPs.

Thank you for all relevant recommendations. I was surprised that my post would have attracted so much attentions!!!!!!

Looks like my complaint was upheld.

Before:
http://s16.postimg.org/j98y8fzn9/speeds.png

After:
http://s18.postimg.org/hk7j7nsvd/speeds2.png

They are not allowed to advertised 24Mbps anymore, so good.

It's not fair if every other ISP obeys the rules and advertises 16 / 17Mbps whilst this one gets away with putting up 24 and seeming to be faster on the surface...

In reply to a post by ukhardy07:

They are not allowed to advertised 24Mbps anymore, so good.

It's not fair if every other ISP obeys the rules and advertises 16 / 17Mbps whilst this one gets away with putting up 24 and seeming to be faster on the surface...

How about you bunch of oiks get your facts correct. There are MANY that offer 24mb Broadband, but I get used to the pond rubbishing everything I mention. Fortunately I am not in need of the sort of advice I find here.

In reply to a post by ukhardy07:

They are not allowed to advertised 24Mbps anymore, so good.

It's not fair if every other ISP obeys the rules and advertises 16 / 17Mbps whilst this one gets away with putting up 24 and seeming to be faster on the surface...

Yes, it's disgusting that ISPs think they can con everyone with false advertising, unwittingly aided and abetted by people they have fooled.

Thankfully the rules can be enforced to protect the innocent.

In reply to a post by professor973:

How about you bunch of oiks get your facts correct. There are MANY that offer 24mb Broadband

If you know of other ISPs that are advertising 24 Mb then let the ASA know. After all, it's not fair that Pulse8 are placed at a disadvantage when it comes to advertising, is it.

In reply to a post by Oliver341:

In reply to a post by professor973:

How about you bunch of oiks get your facts correct. There are MANY that offer 24mb Broadband

If you know of other ISPs that are advertising 24 Mb then let the ASA know. After all, it's not fair that Pulse8 are placed at a disadvantage when it comes to advertising, is it.

I pointed them out when you got on your snotty high horse, but as usual here, you decided to spite just what I have to do with instead of the dozens of ISPs claiming the same - As for disadvantages, I think no contract tie-in even for fibre, no call setup fee, per second billing and 0.8p per minute for calls, should lead you to point out market advantages. - TBB-Pathetic.
http://www.spitfire.co.uk/ADSL2+.shtml
http://www.digiquip.co.uk/faster-broadband-packages....
http://www.datanet.co.uk/connectivity/24mb_broadband...
https://www.xilo.net/adsl_broadband/
http://www.lotustelecom.co.uk/broadband/8mb-24mb-ads...
http://www.vispa.net/vispa-website-pre2010/broadband...

Edited by professor973 (Sat 28-Feb-15 13:38:00)

I think if you stopped labelling everyone who holds an opinion that is different to yours as pathetic you would find that discussions might go better.

Yes, this is a warning that you should treat others better.

In reply to a post by MrSaffron:

I think if you stopped labelling everyone who holds an opinion that is different to yours as pathetic you would find that discussions might go better.

Yes, this is a warning that you should treat others better.

And I think if TBB stopped it's bias and reined in a few trappy anoracks, it might go better. DON'T warn me. If you are going to ban me, ban me.

In reply to a post by professor973:

I pointed them out when you got on your snotty high horse, but as usual here, you decided to spite just what I have to do with instead of the dozens of ISPs claiming the same

I can't imagine why you'd think anyone would want to spite such a pleasant character as yourself.

In reply to a post by Oliver341:

In reply to a post by professor973:

I pointed them out when you got on your snotty high horse, but as usual here, you decided to spite just what I have to do with instead of the dozens of ISPs claiming the same

I can't imagine why you'd think anyone would want to spite such a pleasant character as yourself.

And a snotty condescending character such as yourself ?

In reply to a post by professor973:

And a snotty condescending character such as yourself ?

And all because your precious ISP was made to comply with the regulations. I didn't even bring up their non-compliance in this thread, and you even agreed with the person that did.

To bring some arguing to an end.