New pole required

Hi all,

Wondered if anyone could advise what is likely to happen next.

My grandparents have moved to a property in Tweedsmuir where nobody has lived for around 10 years. They ordered phone and broadband (more like dial up) from Sky and it was meant to be installed yesterday.

When the BT engineer arrived it was determined that the current telephone pole didn't have any capacity for the line and a new one would need to be erected.

They weren't given much in the way of information for what happens next other than at best it'll take a few weeks and someone will be in touch.

Will they need to pay for this? What I don't understand is there is physically a phone line going into the property from the current pole, so what do they mean when they say there is no capacity.

Thanks

When the BT engineer arrived it was determined that the current telephone pole didn't have any capacity for the line and a new one would need to be erected.

That doesn't ring true as an explanation

Will they need to pay for this? What I don't understand is there is physically a phone line going into the property from the current pole, so what do they mean when they say there is no capacity.

I feel sure they will not have to pay any additional costs.

My guess would be that there are no spare pairs from the DP block at the top of the pole going to anywhere useful. If this is the issue, then it still does not explain why a new pole would be required. Is the a red metal D label on the existing pole perchance ?

There should be no extra cost for this beyond the standard charge as I can't imagine it will exceed the threshold for excess construction costs (£3,400). I don't know what the capacity limit might be - possibly it's structural as I imagine a lot of long drop-lines all pulling in one direction might be considered excessive. (The tension required to hold a long drop line up can be surprisingly high).

As to how long it will take, I've no idea. Putting in poles is done all the time, but there's always the potential for complications.

ps. a quick look at the village on Streetview shows that it's served by combined utility poles. That is both main electricity and telephone are on the same poles which may also be a factor.

pps. another factor that can come into play (which I'd forgotten) is about how low a line will be if it crosses a road. There is EU legislation in this matter (to do with clearance for HGVs) and it's a potential safety hazard. A few years ago a (female) telephone engineer was killed when a lorry snagged a telephone line and a pole she was working on came down. On combine utility poles the telephone lines are hung below the power cables so have less clearance. About three years ago the line crossing the road outside my parents' house (on a quiet rural cul-de-sac) was rerouted under the road for exactly those clearance issues.

Edited by deleted (Thu 15-Oct-15 09:33:57)

I don't know what the capacity limit might be - possibly it's structural as I imagine a lot of long drop-lines all pulling in one direction might be considered excessive.

The OP states that there is already a DW in situ, so the load out of the pole is already done.

nb. a quick look at the village on Streetview shows that it's served by combined utility poles. That is both main electricity and telephone are on the same poles which may also be a factor.

Good spot, JUP's cause a whole other load of problems as local power companies have varying rules governing what can and cannot be done. Maybe it's a new carrier pole required to gain more height on a road crossing, but then the DW is already there ..... existing span faulty maybe .... who knows.

BT used to pay compensation if there was a delay installing a phone line. Do Sky do the same?

Not sure on the red D element. Will need to ask, they don't have any mobile network signal and have to drive 3 miles to pick up one. I've text them and will see what they say in a few days.

The property is actually situated outside the village. Around here I believe.

https://www.google.co.uk/maps/place/55%C2%B028'27.0%...

When the ADSL Checker says 'Note: The DP is external to the end user premises.' What does this mean exactly?

Edited by deleted (Thu 15-Oct-15 11:16:03)

The DP line is perfectly normal, most DP are like this, its when the DP is inside the building that things get fun

Hard to tell from that streetview location, but it looks like the power lines (poles with 3 insulators on top) are seperate from the phone lines (single poles).

The Tweedsmuir exchange (WSTWE) is at Glenbreck which is quite a distance away and doesn't have fibre or even 21CN, just ADSL Max.

Yeah it's going to be slow! It'll be fine for them, light web browsing and email pretty much. Mainly need the telephone line as neither Vodafone, EE or Three have signal there.

EE claims to have signal but doesn't. Vodafone said it might, but does not. Going to try O2 next week.

Sky off network broadband, called Sky Connect is expensive (£17 a month?)and is perhaps best avoided.
Have they time to cancel Sky without any charges being applied?

Well when I moved 6 years ago, I had no phone or BB for a month, and tried an (I think) Orange dongle. Complete waste of time, it sort of worked for email but web browsing was useless as could only get a basic GPRS signal on Orange.

Vodaphone and O2 are better as they operate in the 900MHz band which has further coverage than higher frequency operators.

They're not too fussed about broadband. They got a good deal as part of a Sky Package with TV. TV got installed last week so doubt they can cancel anyway.

Just need signal to be able to make phone calls at the moment. They are on Vodafone and EE at the moment but neither have signal. Just O2 left to go.

Sky off-net broadband is amongst the worst possible, along with TalkTalk. They have to buy the BT Wholesale service and give that provision at their end a very low capacity. Congestion can be extreme.

As Apprentice advised, if they can get out of that part of the contract, they should, and go to almost any other BT Wholesale provider. Their connection speed may even be better from one of those than with Sky, and their user experience should be better.

It's just for email, and given how awful the spends will be the hassle to try and get out of contract and go elsewhere (given they don't have a phone to even have that coversation) will be too much hassle for them.

Email should not notice the problem. Browsing could. Online shopping very likely.

I know the area well. It is beautiful but very remote. The only reason the road exists is because of the Scottish Water reservoir at Fruid.

I doubt that the broadband will be usable at all. The Tweedsmuir is not at Glenbreck but further along the A701 in the direction of Broughton - probably 4-5 miles from the house and the telephone lines are extremely poor throughout this part of Tweeddale. Many people in Tweedsmuir find that even email is a struggle. There might be O2 coverage but even that will be very weak because of the topography and forget any thought of 3G.

The delights of rural broadband service in Scotland!

Thanks for this info.

I had doubts about the Internet. ADSL Checker reckons 1.5mbps with a range of 0.5-3.5. Probably going to be the very bottom of the range.

Fingers crossed for o2. Not expecting or need 3G, just need something so they can talk with family and friends

Good luck - for them. Let us know how it works out .

Will do! Might be back for some advise should things not move on in the next few weeks. As I said it's the telephone that's really important now.

Good news! They're online and everything is working okay. More BT engineers showed up Friday and got them connected up with the existing pole. Still don't see why that couldn't happen Wednesdsy but never mind.

Not sure what speeds are like but apparently it's better then they expected and surfing, email and FaceTime is not an issue.

Great.

Is it possible there was some mangled communication and some other work regarding the pole was required but not a new one?

Sounds good. Is that with dialup or ADSL?

In reply to a post by keith969:

Vodaphone and O2 are better as they operate in the 900MHz band which has further coverage than higher frequency operators.

A little simplistic, but one reason why EE (orange/t-mobile) had double the masts to O2 or Vodafone.

The 4G rollout has changed everything for all four networks (EE, Three, Vodafone and O2) - the old rules no longer apply. 4G also travels further than 3G. (simplistic).

ADSL, Sky Connect

In reply to a post by jchamier:

A little simplistic, but one reason why EE (orange/t-mobile) had double the masts to O2 or Vodafone.

The 4G rollout has changed everything for all four networks (EE, Three, Vodafone and O2) - the old rules no longer apply. 4G also travels further than 3G. (simplistic).

Well here in rural Oxfordshire, there's no 4G in our village. I can only get a signal on O2 or Vodaphone, despite being 1Km away from the nearest mast, sometimes not even on 3G.

It's a basic fact that higher frequencies suffer higher atenuation, at least in the GHz range. Just for example, take a wifi router that operates with 2.4GHz and 5GHz. You will find the range of the 5GHz signal much lower than the 2.4GHz one.

Old post I know but I'm visiting this weekend and have been able to test their speeds.

2.88mb at best for the download, was surprised.

http://www.speedtest.net/my-result/i/1593306745

http://www.thinkbroadband.com/speedtest/results.html...