Noone asked my next door neighbour if they could record the details of his router and use it to locate the people living near him. But that's exactly what Google did.

Google only captured details for wifi APs that were freely broadcasting their SSIDs.

If you don't want people to see your wifi AP then you shouldn't broadcast your SSID.

In reply to a post by b4dger:

Noone asked my next door neighbour if they could record the details of his router and use it to locate the people living near him. But that's exactly what Google did.

Google only captured details for wifi APs that were freely broadcasting their SSIDs.

If you don't want people to see your wifi AP then you shouldn't broadcast your SSID.

Most people don't even know their routers are doing this. In a number of ways Google has taken advantage of people's ignorance here - "Wow how do Google do this! It's so clever!!" If more people knew how it was being done they wouldn't be so happy.

In reply to a post by b4dger:

Noone asked my next door neighbour if they could record the details of his router and use it to locate the people living near him. But that's exactly what Google did.

Google only captured details for wifi APs that were freely broadcasting their SSIDs.

If you don't want people to see your wifi AP then you shouldn't broadcast your SSID.

EXACTLY, google have not collected any data from the neighbour which isnt freely available to anyone.

In reply to a post by infra_red:

In reply to a post by b4dger:

Noone asked my next door neighbour if they could record the details of his router and use it to locate the people living near him. But that's exactly what Google did.

Google only captured details for wifi APs that were freely broadcasting their SSIDs.

If you don't want people to see your wifi AP then you shouldn't broadcast your SSID.

Most people don't even know their routers are doing this. In a number of ways Google has taken advantage of people's ignorance here - "Wow how do Google do this! It's so clever!!" If more people knew how it was being done they wouldn't be so happy.

Maybe they should turn wireless off if they dont use it.

If they do use it and they claim they didnt know their router broadcasts that info, then maybe they should ask thereself how they knew which wireless point was theres to connect the other stuff in their home to.

Arguing google has invaded your privacy when you broadcast the data they collect is like blaming a criminal for identity theft if you deliberately gave them your life history and all your personal documents.

Does your neighbour use different passwords for each website? If not i suggest they do incase someone one day sits next to them and watches them type their password openly without hiding the fact they are recording it.

Seriously im all for privacy but if you willingly hand that information out over the airwaves, you have no right to complain when someone takes it.

In reply to a post by seb:

The blocks are registered in such a way that you can't really pin-point which part of the country someone is in.. Virgin Media are a good exception to that but even then it's generalities.

UK Online/Sky are another exception. You can work out what exchange someone is on with Sky/UKO LLU services. Just do a reverse traceroute to the IP - the hop before the customer gives the exchange code.
I believe the netblock also gives the exchange code.

Matt

In reply to a post by b4dger:

If you don't want people to see your wifi AP then you shouldn't broadcast your SSID.

Also don't use the network. Not broadcasting SSID doesn't mean its not visible.

Many tools (including inSSIDer, and WiFiFoFum on Windows Mobile handsets) can show hidden SSIDs......

In reply to a post by jchamier:

In reply to a post by b4dger:

If you don't want people to see your wifi AP then you shouldn't broadcast your SSID.

Also don't use the network. Not broadcasting SSID doesn't mean its not visible.

Many tools (including inSSIDer, and WiFiFoFum on Windows Mobile handsets) can show hidden SSIDs......

Just turn damn wireless off, buy a 2 quid cat5 network cable and be done with it i say LOL
I dont run wireless, its slow, always has been slow and why would i want slow performance on a machine in another room when im paying money for a service i could get better service from just buying a cable??
One cable equals better performance, better security, and two fingered salute to google tracking, problem solved LOL

"google are clear what their app does"

O'really?

So, wise one, answer me this.

Google Maps for Mobile on a smartphone can work out where it is based on WiFi info (no GPS necessary). Does it (or anything similar from Google) then upload the "where I am" and "what services I see" info back to Daddy to help keep Daddy's database up to date, thus requiring the user to unknowingly act as an unpaid data collector for Google (in return for the benefit of using GMM or other Google app)?

If Google are clear on what their apps do, this question should be easy to answer shouldn't it?

Yesterday my Google account asked me to fill in more "account verification" info. One of the bits they wanted was my mobile number. Two years ago they'd have got it. Now I'm older and wiser there's no way they're having any more identifiable info about me than they already have, and as time goes by I will do my best to reduce the usefulness of what they already have. I already gave up on Gmail for example.

It's the *unknowing* bit, the inability to make a reasonably informed decision, that's a big problem. The scale of the information gathering is another factor.

"Google only captured details for wifi APs that were freely broadcasting their SSIDs."#

Are you sure about that? There have been many reliable reports that their snooping receivers didn't just record the (e)SSID and location, but also recorded packet contents. If your intention is to solely listen to broadcast SSIDs, netstumbler style, you can do that very simply.

If your intentions also include capturing SSIDs where "SSID broadcast" is disabled, that's not difficult either, you simply listen to (and record) *all* the traffic (go read about Kismet, for example).

It's trivially easy for an unauthorised bystander to get SSIDs even when SSID broadcast is disabled. Disabling SSID broadcast is *not* an effective security or privacy measure, though it may help avoid some accidental/unwanted connections.

Its all clear the moment you go to use their apps, my god it even asks you almost in complete idiot terms do you want to be tracked........ Obviously some have difficulty understand the question an app on a screen asks and answering yes or no.

I suggest some people do not touch anything which involves radio waves........ Or put on your foil hat

Edited by deleted (Sun 05-Sep-10 22:50:39)