If you raise it as a BB issue with BT they will get somebody out to you who is an actual engineer. No other ISP sends out their own guys. Other ISPs all use BT openreach for all of their faults.

I never fully understood how talktalk worked. I believe they send out their own engineers as they are cheaper than sending out BT but I get a little lost as surely the engineers can't touch BTs equipment? (which renders them useless for anything complex). I could be entirely wrong here. I've always wondered what they can actually do.

I'm hopeful that BT will get this resolved.

As a side note the homehub is good at holding onto connections on long lines with interference. When it arrives please give it a go. It's amazing what a different router chipset etc can do. I doubt it'll resolve everything but it might be slightly better at holding on.

& yes there is unlikely to ever be LLU at the exchange.

In reply to a post by ukhardy07:

I never fully understood how talktalk worked. I believe they send out their own engineers as they are cheaper than sending out BT but I get a little lost as surely the engineers can't touch BTs equipment? (which renders them useless for anything complex). I could be entirely wrong here. I've always wondered what they can actually do.

TalkTalk (Qube) engineers exist because they are cheaper for faults inside the home (they charge £50, but if BT find a fault inside the home TT still charge you £50, but BT charges TT £140 odd), and I think they can deal with TT LLU exchange equipment as well.

Yeah, the 3 Qube engineers I had basically plugged in a new router in the test socket, then phoned the same call centre I could call, then the call centre ignores them and it just stops there...

Well fingers crossed, we'll see what happens...

JF.

EDIT: Cube's changed for Qube's...

Edited by deleted (Thu 28-Feb-13 18:38:36)

Just a one correction. Not 'Cube' but 'Qube'.

In reply to a post by burakkucat:

Just a one correction. Not 'Cube' but 'Qube'.

Thanks for that, and fixed!

Also as a short update, got a call from TalkTalk UK about 1630 (apparently they want to provide a better service now we're leaving...), and they told me the fault had just been cleared as fixed by Openreach, and they just wondered if that was right...

JF.

Well guys, its been a while.

We're back with BT now, as the information here was that they can deal with faults better. Doesn't seem to be the case yet.

In the month leading up to switching over TalkTalk were hounding me to send an engineer up, so I caved and they sent 2 more bringing the total up to about 10+ (I've lost count if I'm honest). so out of the 10 - 1 dealt with an iffy connection and improved the line (but did not completely cure it), 1 swapped pairs from the exchange to the property, 1 comprehensively checked every stretch of cable between us and the exchange and concluded the fault lay within the exchange (so much for BT's equipment never being at fault(!)), 1 checked the line from the house, then listened on the board at the exchange and agreed the fault lay within the exchange, 1 read the notes and phoned me from the exchange to let me know there was no point in him coming out*, 2 never bothered to turn up, and 5 did nothing beyond plugging in their tester and then saying there's nothing they could do.

*This engineer explained to me that OFCOM ordered the breaking up of BT into 3 different companies. Openreach installs/repairs/maintains the cables. Wholesale installs exchange equipment. And another that I can't remember maintains/repairs exchange equipment. He also gave me an Openreach fault reference number relating to our problem.

One of the times TalkTalk phoned it was a UK based call centre, so I explained what was going on, and gave him the fault code the engineer had given me, he said I'll check this out and give you a call back. And true to his word he did half an hour later. He said there was a problem with the tracking system and that because of the way this fault had been logged, or the type of fault it is, or whatever, it doesn't work with the tracking system. And that was it, he accepted there was no point in sending an engineer out, and wished me the best of luck.

So now that we're switched back (as they love to say) to BT I decided to phone their fault line and see if they had any better idea what is going on. Turns out they don't. They wanted to go through all the basic checks (is it plugged in? Is it switched on? Are you using a cable to connect to the router? Are you using filters? etc...) I just went with it (there's no point in fighting the script). Anyway, so she decides an engineer visit is required, I say there's no point, here's an Openreach code, speak to them please. That code doesn't work, means nothing, we'll send an engineer out. So an engineer is due to turn up tomorrow (Saturday). I wonder what will happen(!).

And just to fill the page is, here's my lovely brand new HomeHub3's stats.

ADSL Line Status

Connection Information

Line state: Connected
Connection time: 0 days, 05:58:16
Downstream: 320 Kbps
Upstream: 448 Kbps

ADSL Settings

VPI/VCI: 0/38
Type: PPPoA
Modulation: G.992.1 Annex A
Latency type: Interleaved
Noise margin (Down/Up): 13.8 dB / 13.0 dB
Line attenuation (Down/Up): 71.1 dB / 31.5 dB
Output power (Down/Up): 15.0 dBm / 12.5 dBm
FEC Events (Down/Up): 1253738 / 372
CRC Events (Down/Up): 6944 / 32
Loss of Framing (Local/Remote): 0 / 0
Loss of Signal (Local/Remote): 0 / 0
Loss of Power (Local/Remote): 0 / 0
HEC Events (Down/Up): 2899 / 23
Error Seconds (Local/Remote): 3564 / 309

And a BT Wholesale Speedtest:
First
Download - 0.13
Uplead - 0.34
Ping - 179.5
Second
Download - 0.14
Upload - 0.26
Ping - 50.25

Aproaching 5 months fast, but I don't blame TalkTalk, not their line equipment or engineers, all they can say is its still not working and rely on BT to do their job.

JF.

Looking at your first post where you said this:

One of our neighbors said he had tons of trouble, until they replaced his stretch of overhead, but how do I get them to do that? I've spoken to the engineers before on other jobs on this line, the trouble is the overhead wire goes through trees and gets constantly bashed from them, breaking up the cable inside.

which is reinforced by this comment from TalkTalk Fault Management:

.....and she tells me she had spoken to the engineer at Openreach, and that he had explained to her that our cable has degraded to such an extent that the only real fix was to "replace the entire 7.5km from the exchange the the property

Surely this issue should be addressed first? Are all these checks on the line and equipment only passing the line as suitable for voice calls?

Well it turns out while his line needed replaced to get acceptable service, he still has the same fault as us. The fault actually turns out to affect a significant number of people served by the same exchange. However a lot of the people wont accept there is an issue, as it doesnt affect them as much as us (because we are 2nd from last on the line (the last guys are on satellite))

The comment from TalkTalk Fault Management turned out to be a load of rubbish/incorrect report by an engineer/whatever. Thing is 2 of the more recent engineers have proved the fault lies within the exchange by replicating it before the cable even leaves the building.

I shall persevere, but I have a funny feeling I will continue to get the "your line is fine" and the "your broadband speed is within range" rubbish.

JF.

In reply to a post by 405mi16:

<snip>

*This engineer explained to me that OFCOM ordered the breaking up of BT into 3 different companies. Openreach installs/repairs/maintains the cables. Wholesale installs exchange equipment. And another that I can't remember maintains/repairs exchange equipment.

<snip>

BT Openreach are responsible for the 'first mile' (or 'last mile', depending on which direction you look) which is located in public places (up poles, down holes, etc) and EU locations (domestic or business), whilst BT Operate are responsible for the exchange based equipment, the FTTCs and the fibre optic feed to/from the latter.

Oh well, after nearly a month of dealing with the BT Priority Care Team I can now say.... I have got nowhere!

(As a side note it would appear since the guy apparently changed "some" equipment in the exchange my attenuation has increased from 69.6 right up to 71.6!)

Anyway, currently on down/up 320/480kbps (250 ip profile) with shed-loads of errors of all kinds, virtually nothing (no internet, just times out) in the evening, iPhone wont even download a basic app.

Like I say, used to get fine 1Mbps to 1.25Mbps speeds, low SNR etc. Hell, I used to have Netflix! barely get internet radio now, let alone streaming a film!

If anyone has any suggestions as to how to get on with this, to be honest I feel like just... Maybe better not say that. Its very depressing anyway. Nobody seems to be listening to me, Openreach keep closing the fault saying there's nothing wrong with the line, the Priority Care boy told me 62dB is the ceiling for broadband, and that attenuation will gradually increase over time (yep, 2dB over a couple of weeks sounds about right(!))...

And all Google says is to call the Samaritans, and they cant even help!

Thanks, JF.

You had a modulation of

Modulation: G.992.1 Annex A

before, is it still the same? There may have been a change to ADSL2+ which on a long line like yours is probably not a good idea. Most reasonable routers let you override this setting.

The 62dB is more FUD, as the 62/63 value is usually just the maximum attenuation routers display. But 71dB attenuation is right at the edge of things working or not.

Unplug all ADSL hardware, and if there is noise when using a corded phone at the test socket, report a noisy telephone line with no mention of broadband,

Edited by MrSaffron (Wed 24-Apr-13 16:27:20)