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RobertoS
(elder) Tue 30-Sep-14 22:17:25

Re: Issues connecting with certain sites

[re: deleted] [link to this post]

Look at steps 10 and 14 in those two tracerts.

One try is timing out. That means huge holdups are occurring occasionally somewhere up to those points. Solid timeouts like those that follow are a different thing altogether - they just mean the router there is set not to respond to pings.

It has to be congestion somewhere. I've said where I think it will be.

My broadband basic info/help site - www.robertos.me.uk | Domains,site and mail hosting - Tsohost.
Connection - Plusnet UnLim Fibre (FTTC). Sync ~ 56.6/14.1Mbps @ 600m. - BQM

"Angels can fly because they can take themselves lightly." - G K Chesterton.

ian007jen
(member) Tue 30-Sep-14 22:30:50

Re: Issues connecting with certain sites

[re: RobertoS] [link to this post]

Are you on BT Wholesale ADSL

Yes (market 1 SWRSO)

What does that same tracert give for your first two or three hops after your router?

Text

traceroute to www.ukmail.com (80.193.64.202), 30 hops max, 38 byte packets
 1  88-144-0-1.host.pobb.as13285.net (88.144.0.1)  36.130 ms  37.454 ms  35.759 ms 2  host-78-151-225-59.static.as13285.net (78.151.225.59)  36.280 ms  37.002 ms  35.818 ms
 3  host-78-151-225-182.static.as13285.net (78.151.225.182)  36.722 ms  host-78-151-225-166.static.as13285.net (78.151.225.166)  36.496 ms  host-78-151-225-247.static.as13285.net (78.151.225.247)  37.740 ms 4  host-78-144-11-79.as13285.net (78.144.11.79)  43.975 ms  host-78-144-11-85.as13285.net (78.144.11.85)  46.404 ms  host-78-144-11-79.as13285.net (78.144.11.79)  43.921 ms
 5  host-78-144-10-134.as13285.net (78.144.10.134)  43.948 ms  host-78-144-10-62.as13285.net (78.144.10.62)  42.449 ms  host-78-144-10-122.as13285.net (78.144.10.122)  43.590 ms 6  virgin-media-pp-the.as13285.net (78.144.3.66)  42.638 ms  43.625 ms  44.369 ms
 7  nrth-bb-1b-ae7-0.network.virginmedia.net (62.253.174.17)  70.265 ms  44.538 ms  46.860 ms 8  nrth-bb-2a-ae2-0.network.virginmedia.net (62.254.42.129)  51.839 ms  133.024 ms  47.801 ms
 9  brhm-bb-2a-ae4-0.network.virginmedia.net (62.254.42.45)  46.883 ms  45.756 ms  47.664 ms10  manc-bb-2a-ae1-0.network.virginmedia.net (62.254.42.50)  47.447 ms  48.456 ms  48.086 ms
11  manc-bb-1c-ae2-0.network.virginmedia.net (62.254.42.114)  49.366 ms  47.956 ms  50.359 ms12  perr-core-2a-ae0-0.network.virginmedia.net (62.255.149.66)  52.262 ms  51.178 ms  50.559 ms
13  perr-pe-2-ge500.network.virginmedia.net (80.1.69.178)  49.108 ms  48.707 ms  49.095 ms14  82.36.14.2 (82.36.14.2)  51.550 ms  50.969 ms  50.330 ms
15  *  *  *16  *  *  *
17  *  *  *18  *  *  *
19  *  *  *20  *  *  *
21  *  *  *22  *  *  *
23  *  *  *24  *

RobertoS
(elder) Tue 30-Sep-14 22:45:14

Re: Issues connecting with certain sites

[re: ian007jen] [link to this post]

There again, multiple addresses within a hop.

To me that could be a congested system desperately trying to find an open route to the final destination. Tracerts are normally all the same address per line, even if that changes on later tracerts.

That is an argument against my suggestion earlier that the holdup is at the BTW WBMC node, though not conclusive.

deleted
(deleted) Tue 30-Sep-14 22:48:24

Re: Issues connecting with certain sites

[re: RobertoS] [link to this post]

Steps 10 and 14? Both traceroutes only got to 10 I thoight?

Zarjaz
(knowledge is power) Tue 30-Sep-14 22:49:33

Re: Issues connecting with certain sites

[re: XRaySpeX] [link to this post]

If it helps, it won't load from the url. but will from the IP address for me too. This being from a BT Wholesale based connection too.

Zarjaz

RobertoS
(elder) Tue 30-Sep-14 23:16:50

Re: Issues connecting with certain sites

[re: deleted] [link to this post]

Sorry, yes you're right. However I spotted the problem in yours and somehow picked up the wrong hops when writing the post.

Yours does it in hops 4,5,6,7,8 and 10 in the first one, and gives up after 8 in the second.

Once it changes at hop 4, it isn't surprising it is different afterwards, as hop 3 has chosen a different route. Suggestion the hold-up is later than hop 3.

I realise I'm changing my story as I go along as to where the holdup is. That's because I'm thinking more about something we just don't normally see happening.

See mine from earlier:-

Microsoft Windows [Version 6.3.9600]
(c) 2013 Microsoft Corporation. All rights reserved.

C:\Users\Bob>tracert 80.193.64.202

Tracing route to 80.193.64.202 over a maximum of 30 hops

1     1 ms     1 ms     1 ms  192.168.1.254
  2    16 ms    13 ms    13 ms  lo0-central10.ptw-ag02.plus.net [195.166.128.196]
  3    14 ms    15 ms    17 ms  link-b-central10.ptw-gw02.plus.net [212.159.2.150]
  4    14 ms    24 ms    13 ms  xe-0-2-0.ptw-cr02.plus.net [212.159.0.250]
  5    15 ms    15 ms    13 ms  195.66.236.23
  6    13 ms    13 ms    13 ms  popl-bb-1c-ae9-0.network.virginmedia.net [213.105.159.118]
  7    54 ms    44 ms    13 ms  popl-bb-2a-ae3-0.network.virginmedia.net [62.254.42.93]
  8    37 ms    16 ms    15 ms  nrth-bb-2a-ae0-0.network.virginmedia.net [62.254.42.69]
  9    17 ms    18 ms    17 ms  brhm-bb-2a-ae4-0.network.virginmedia.net [62.254.42.45]
 10    19 ms    23 ms    18 ms  manc-bb-2a-ae1-0.network.virginmedia.net [62.254.42.50]
 11    24 ms    18 ms    44 ms  manc-bb-1c-ae2-0.network.virginmedia.net [62.254.42.114]
 12    22 ms    28 ms    22 ms  perr-core-2a-ae0-0.network.virginmedia.net [62.255.149.66]
 13    22 ms    21 ms    21 ms  perr-pe-2-ge500.network.virginmedia.net [80.1.69.178] 
 14    19 ms    21 ms    19 ms  82.36.14.2
 15     *        *        *     Request timed out.
 16  ^C

Unfortunately we don't know where things go after 82.36.14.2, which is still within Virgin Media backhaul.

deleted
(deleted) Wed 01-Oct-14 11:02:13

Re: Issues connecting with certain sites

[re: RobertoS] [link to this post]

Guessing the hops are those inside the talk talk network (Opatel?)

The addresses as13285.net all link back to Opatel. Question now then (which there may be no obvious answer) is whether this is an issue of Talk Talk not buying enough wholesale capacity or whether there is just general congestion inside the talk talk network unrelated to the capacity purchased from bt wholesale?

deleted
(deleted) Wed 01-Oct-14 12:39:57

Re: Issues connecting with certain sites

[re: deleted] [link to this post]

Lower MTU on router to 1300 to account for loss of packet in pppoa.

XRaySpeX
(eat-sleep-adslguide) Wed 01-Oct-14 14:04:48

Re: Issues connecting with certain sites

[re: RobertoS] [link to this post]

In reply to a post by RobertoS:
What are those multiple IP addresses on some hops doing there? Successive pings seem to be going different routes.

What does that mean? I've never seen it before

Perhaps cuz we are running on Windows but OP is using Unix traceroute.

1999: Freeserve 48K Dial-Up => 2005: Wanadoo 1 Meg BB => 2007: Orange 2 Meg BB => 2008: Orange 8 Meg LLU => 2010: Orange 16 Meg LLU => 2011: Orange 20 Meg WBC

MrSaffron
(staff) Wed 01-Oct-14 14:09:45

Re: Issues connecting with certain sites

[re: deleted] [link to this post]

1300 seems unusually low generally 1400 was an old value that seemed to work for AOL specifically at one time, but generally 1458 is the norm.

Andrew Ferguson, [email protected]
www.thinkbroadband.com
Personal website including useful broadband snippets and maps

The author of the above post is a thinkbroadband staff member. It may not constitute an official statement on behalf of thinkbroadband.

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