New home network

I'm looking at moving into a new house and deciding how to build my network, I could go full Unifi, but I want some multi gig for future use.

What's the question exactly....

In reply to a post by Pheasant:

What's the question exactly....

I'm looking for some hardware advice on what I could use?
Firewall/router, switch and access point or 2

Thought about going Unifi but not sure about their firewall, and I'm possibly going to need 2.5Gb.

I would follow the YAGNI principle: by the time you actually need 2.5G you'll be able to get something cheaper and more suitable.

The trouble with 2.5G is knowing how it is going to be presented to you from the future ONT, and how you will distribute it to your downstream devices. The most likely interface types are:

* 10G on an SFP+ port, with either copper direct-attach or fibre SFP+ module
* 10G on RJ45 copper (10GbaseT)
* 2.5G on RJ45 copper (2.5GbaseT)

The device you buy will depend on what both the upstream ISP and the downstream PCs and wireless access points need.

For example: the Mikrotik RB5009UG+S+IN has one SFP+ socket (10G) and one RJ45 port capable of 2.5G. Does this future-proof you? No. Suppose the ONT given by the ISP presents you with 2.5GbaseT, and also your wireless access point needs 2.5GbaseT. You don't have enough compatible ports. So then you'd end up having to buy a separate switch, with a 10G uplink to the router, and the right types of other ports to the other devices.

It has definitely not shaken out what the residential market might settle on when higher speed services are widely provided.

In the data centre space, SFP+ and 10GbaseT are the rule. So there's plenty of kit up there, but most of it is out of the price range for the normal consumer. I've never actually seen a 2.5G copper interface; I believe this standard was created purely to maximise the longevity of standard Cat5e cabling, which cannot handle 10G, primarily to deliver more bandwidth to wireless access points. It's possible the residential market will use this. But don't forget that different ISPs may use different technologies, and you may not know today which altnet(s) will be available to your location either.

So if you want to future-proof, my recommendation would be that if you're installing copper cabling, then choose Cat6 or Cat6A (the former is good for distances of up to 37m, the latter for 100m) instead of Cat5e. But don't try to future-proof your routing or switching hardware. Buy what you need today, and if you need to replace it in 2 or 3 years then do so.

Me: I have Mikrotik RB4011iGS+RM (for business FTTP) and hEX PoE (for home FTTC), and two Unifi AC Lite. I think the latter have now been superceded by Wifi 6 Lite, but since I don't have any Wifi 6 kit yet, I'm not going to be upgrading them for a while.

If you need lots of copper 1G RJ45 ports, then the Netgear GS724Tv4 is a cheap and silent workhorse. It supports SNMP, VLANs, web management *and* a telnet CLI that you can turn on. No serial console though, and no 10G uplink. The smaller GS110TP gives you 8 1G RJ45 ports with PoE out (not PoE+ though), as well as two 1G SFP ports.

Edited by candlerb (Wed 01-Dec-21 11:24:07)

In reply to a post by candlerb:

In the data centre space, SFP+ and 10GbaseT are the rule.

Which data centre is that? There are literally hundreds of 10Gbps ports at work and not a single 10GBaseT port in sight.

Datacentres are in my experience exclusively SFP+, to the point where if I where presented with a 10GBase-T device the first port of call would be to change the NIC and if that was not possible there would be lots of cursing and swearing.

In any data centre run by anyone competent will also be exclusively SFP+ for 10Gbps speeds, because it's cheaper to buy, cheaper to run and way more flexible.

A large part of the reason why 10GBase-T has more interoperability issues than consumers are used to is that unlike 1000Base-T where there was a shake down in the data centre market before consumers got their hands on it, no such shake down has happened with 10GBase-T in the data centre because we don't use it and don't want it now or anytime in the future.

For the domestic market just run Cat6a cabling or at a pinch Cat6. You may well not terminate it properly for 10GBase-T but if there is some slack in the cable you can always come back and get it done properly when you actually need 10Gbps speeds if it doesn't work.

Even if the ONT presents as an SFP+ then you could use a suitable SFP+ transceiver noting while most of them are limited to 30m of cable, you can get ones rated for 80m now. That is unlikely to be an issue in a domestic setting unless you live in a mansion.

In reply to a post by jabuzzard:

Which data centre is that? There are literally hundreds of 10Gbps ports at work and not a single 10GBaseT port in sight.

And there are other data centres use a mix of SFP+ and 10GbaseT (as in the ones I work at). If this weren't true, then you wouldn't be able to buy 10GbaseT switches from all the major vendors.

I’ve got various switches with embedded 10GBaseT capable ports and they all play nicely with a mixture of different clients NIC at all speeds up to and including 10G, both using PoE and non-POE.

The only ‘limitation’ I have come across is the fact that certain manufacturers will only step their ports from 10G/5G/2.5G/1G down to 100Mbps and will not go lower (i.e no legacy 10 Mbps - and there are still manufacturers of modern/newly minted kit (albeit I’ve noticed mainly in the IOT space) that still push out gear with ‘only’ 10Mbps Ethernet interfaces….

Where I have noticed some incompatibility is when using SFP+ pluggable 10GBaseT modules - I don’t think there’s is the standardisation in high speed copper SFP+ spec and/or there is a compatibly issues with universal 10GBaseT pluggables - at least I’ve seen a lot of 10GBaseT pluggables not work with various SFP+ cages / switches.

So if tending to using 10GBaseT I would prefer embedded switch modules over SFP+ cages and 10GBaseT pluggables.

Just circling back as spotted a couple of new UI switch models which could be of interest...

Ubiquiti have a couple of newish switches that may be of interest:

UniFi Switch Enterprise 8 PoE (USW-Enterprise-8-PoE) which has 8 x 2.5 GbE ports with 802.3at PoE. EuroDK don't have stock currently, but the price is a fairly reasonable £330+VAT

Ubiquiti UniFi Switch Flex XG (USW-Flex-XG) which has 4 x 10 GbE ports and 1 PoE-in GbE port. EuroDK do have stock of this model at around £206+VAT

There's also several other higher port count models on their UI switches page here.

I appreciate you pointing out those switches. I'm just considering building a 1 Gig network for now and if I need higher later then I can upgrade. Trying to keep my budget small.

So considering Unifi or Omada,
Basically looking for a 24 port switch with PoE
2 small 5 or 8 port non PoE switches (PoE powered would be a shout)
Either 1/2 roof APs or 2/3 in wall or a mix.

Then looking for some kind of CCTV system that has IP cameras with Poe probably about 6 of them. Unifi Protect seems too expensive so possibly Reolink?

Generally tend to go for either Netgear, Ubiquiti or MikroTik for switches.

On CCTV all of my cameras now are HIK with a a couple of Reolink PTZs. They have been fine.