Do NOW still provide phone line over copper?

I was just chatting to Plusnet about my renewal, and to upgrade to faster fibre (I already have 30Mbps) they want me to ditch the landline.

NOW have a faster, cheaper and shorter contract, apparently without this stipulation, but I hesitated to order, as it's not absolutely clear it will be over the existing copper.

Will it be?

I do know copper is being retired anyway, although I'm sceptical whether it will be by end 2025 as announced, as I think too many elderly and disabled (I count myself in that) still depend on it.

So, if I hit "order" on the NOW offering, do I have anything to worry about?

Ditching the landline (as in telephone service) and moving away from copper are two totally different things.

The 2025 date you quote is the date when phone connection through the PSTN system will cease. From that date your existing phone service sending an analogue voice signal to the switching apparatus in the local exchange and on to the wider world will no longer work. Instead your ISP will have to provide you with compatible equipment so that your existing phone will connect via your router and your phone will converse with the rest of the world by having the analogue voice signal converted to a digital signal and then being processed through your router and the internet. However, that will still happen through your existing landline until FTTP is available.

When your location has fibre installed so that you can order FTTP then your phone and internet connection will come off the copper and onto the fibre and the copper connection to the existing street cabinet or exchange will cease to work but that may well be many years after 2025.

Unless you already have the capability to create an FTTP connection Plusnet cannot ditch your landline connection as that would cease any internet that you have but they can move you over to the digital VoIP phone system.

Edited by GonePostal (Tue 29-Aug-23 13:23:59)

OK, so I didn't phrase it quite right. Plusnet were pushing me to "upgrade" to faster broadband, but it didn't come with any associated telephone service, which for me was a "downgrade", as I still want and need my landline service. NOW don't seem to have this limitation, but it isn't absolutely crystal clear, so I didn't want to sign-up but then find my phone doesn't work because I don't have a VOIP handset (or an adaptor).

Edit: Whilst it is nowhere named in so many words, I believe the package they were pushing me to upgrade to must have been FTTP. This was a complete no-go for me, because of the phone.

NOW are offering comparable speeds (and cheaper), but seemingly still by FTTC, which would mean I wouldn't lose the landline. But I was looking for some reassurance before I sign-up and find I got that bit wrong!

Edited by TLM (Tue 29-Aug-23 13:35:30)

Unless your property has FTTP available, then the service will be delivered over copper. There is no timeline for removal of all copper, although Openreach are targeting 85% UK coverage by December 2026.

Voice services are a different matter.

From next week (5th Sep 2023), you will be unable to order an analogue voice service - i.e. dialtone originating from equipment in the exchange. The analogue phone network will be completely switched off in December 2025.

Plusnet don't offer any digital voice. But as far as I know, they're also not using SOGEA (that is, broadband without a linked analogue phone service). So if you renew today, you should be able to keep your phone number and analogue phone service, but only for the next 2 years.

As I understand it, NOW is a sub-brand of Sky. Sky have been doing digital voice for years. Therefore, if you switch to NOW, I would expect that they would supply your phone service as digital voice. That means you'd plug your phone handset into a port on the router they supply, instead of into the BT socket in the wall.

This does mean that there would be no phone service to your house in the event of a power cut (unless you have battery backup for your router). But this is a bullet you're going to have to bite in 2 years time anyway. If you don't use the landline for voice calls, then this won't be a concern.

It's the powercut scenario I'm a bit worried about, as I'm disabled (invisibly so, but still disabled).

Reading between the lines, I've come to the conclusion FTTP must be available, and it was this PN were trying to push on me.

But yes, I could still renew my current package (inclusive of phone) as of today. They didn't really want me to, though.

In reply to a post by GonePostal:

Unless you already have the capability to create an FTTP connection Plusnet cannot ditch your landline connection as that would cease any internet that you have but they can move you over to the digital VoIP phone system.

Plusnet recently launched an SOGEA-based product (which they call 'Fibre', as opposed to their FTTP-based 'Full Fibre') which has no option for Digital Voice / VoIP.

AFAIK if you recontract to get a discount you have to move to one of these two products and loose your existing PSTN service, or you can stay with them on the out-of-contract pricing. To retain broadband with DV / VoIP others have suggested that they will offer migration to BT (and likely EE since they have recently announced a DV option), even in-contract.

In reply to a post by candlerb:

Plusnet don't offer any digital voice. But as far as I know, they're also not using SOGEA (that is, broadband without a linked analogue phone service). So if you renew today, you should be able to keep your phone number and analogue phone service, but only for the next 2 years.

They launched SOGEA and removed FTTC+WLR a couple of weeks ago https://www.ispreview.co.uk/index.php/2023/08/uk-isp...

Thank you, this! The product is just called "Fibre". It's faster than I have at the moment, but includes no phone service, so was an instant no-no.

I don't really need the additional speed anyway. Not that it wouldn't be quite nice, but if it's only at the cost of losing the landline, the latter is more important by far.

In reply to a post by TLM:

OK, so I didn't phrase it quite right. Plusnet were pushing me to "upgrade" to faster broadband, but it didn't come with any associated telephone service, which for me was a "downgrade", as I still want and need my landline service. NOW don't seem to have this limitation, but it isn't absolutely crystal clear, so I didn't want to sign-up but then find my phone doesn't work because I don't have a VOIP handset (or an adaptor).

Edit: Whilst it is nowhere named in so many words, I believe the package they were pushing me to upgrade to must have been FTTP. This was a complete no-go for me, because of the phone.

NOW are offering comparable speeds (and cheaper), but seemingly still by FTTC, which would mean I wouldn't lose the landline. But I was looking for some reassurance before I sign-up and find I got that bit wrong!

If it's only 30M, it won't be FTTP, it will be FTTC.

I've just checked on the availability checker, and new Plusnet FTTC services are being supplied without phone service. This means they are using SOGEA after all.

Plusnet is part of the BT group, so if you say you need a phone service, they'll push you toward BT or EE instead.

You should be able to stick with your analogue line for now if you remain with Plusnet and just let the service roll on, but you'll be paying extortionate out-of-contract rates, and you'll lose service come December 2025.

For *any* new service you migrate to now, it will either come with digital voice or no voice.

There is an opportunity here for you to migrate your phone number to a standalone VoIP provider (which is what I've done - and I haven't bought any VoIP equipment, I just use a mobile phone app as a softphone). This completely decouples the phone service from the broadband service.

If you don't want to get involved with this, then you'll need to find a provider which supplies digital voice on their router. The downsides of this are:
- you are tied to using the ISP-supplied router
- every time you change broadband provider, you will be limited to only those who provide digital voice services - which is a small and diminishing set, so you won't get the best deals
- every time you change broadband provider, there's a (small) risk that they'll make a mistake with the migration of your voice service and your phone number will get lost

To answer your original question, yes, they will provide your phone service over copper. I've just signed up to a Now contract and it's actually GEA FTTC as usual, but the PSTN is still LLU/MPF, i.e. goes back to Sky's equipment in the child exchange that my phone line connects to. I still have an E-side (so not SoGEA) and the phone works in the NTE5 socket like it has done for decades.

For clarity, I have relatives who live in an area where copper services are no longer available. The Now availability checker does not let you order there, with a message of:

"We are sorry, NOW Broadband is unavailable at your address.

While we can’t supply you with a service, Sky, our sibling company, may have some options available in your area."

When I dial 17070 I get a "welcome to Sky" message which shows it's going back to their exchange kit.

Great prices, and 1 month in, great service so far.

Hope this helps.