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thinking of moving to talktalk, as its the only LLU provider in my exchange, i get a reliable consistent speed with my upto 8mb
Link Power State: L0
Mode: G.DMT
Channel: Fast
Trellis: ON
Line Status: No Defect
Training Status: Showtime
Down Up
SNR (dB): 5.1 23.0
Attn(dB): 29.0 14.5
Pwr(dBm): 19.8 12.3
Max(Kbps): 9920 1112
Rate (Kbps): 8128 448
so what can i expect on ADSL2+
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how accurate is that likely to be?
if thats the case, its quite an improvment 
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Register (or login) on our website and you will not see this ad.
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Expect 14 Meg (not 16; Jack forgot that attn. increases by about 3 dB with ADSL2+!).
1999: Freeserve 48K Dial-Up => 2005: Wanadoo 1 Meg BB => 2007: Orange 2 Meg BB => 2008: Orange 8 Meg LLU => 2010: Orange 16 Meg LLU => 2011: Orange 17 Meg Untweaked 19 Meg Tweaked WBC
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you will need to check that the exchnage in ADSL2 eabled as sometimes llu activity takes place ready for ADSL2 whtiuth ADSL2 atvication taking place - www.sam knows.com will confirm whether ADSL2 enabled or whether your exchnage in only up to 8meg -- if you ae more that a mile or soe from the exchange evening if ADSL2 was undettaken benefits will diminish as distance from exchange increases -- anything over a mile of so will be not great
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If I can understand you ...
Nothing to do with exchange being ADSL2 enabled. What BT do to exchange is nowt to do with TT and OP stated that TT was LLU enabled there. if you ae more that a mile or soe from the exchange evening if ADSL2 was undettaken benefits will diminish as distance from exchange increases -- anything over a mile of so will be not great A mile is not bad; more like 2 miles before benefits disappear. OP's attenuation is sufficient to tell us he is just over 2 km line from exchange.
1999: Freeserve 48K Dial-Up => 2005: Wanadoo 1 Meg BB => 2007: Orange 2 Meg BB => 2008: Orange 8 Meg LLU => 2010: Orange 16 Meg LLU => 2011: Orange 17 Meg Untweaked 19 Meg Tweaked WBC
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spoke with a couple neighbours, who i did not know were on talktalk, anyway first i spoke with this afternoon, let me run a speedtest on her laptop (wired) and she wa sgetting 6942 down, and 435 up
spoke with another tonight about 10 mins in to Xfactor, and his download was about 2200, but upload at 650. (also wired)
is this slowdown typical when the x factor is on? or is it just the time of night?
he is going to do a few speedtests later tonight for me.
btw my exchange is LLU enabled, and has been confirmed by talktalk, and samknows.
and the exchange serves around 1900 homes (not all talktalk might i add)
Edited by deleted (Sun 06-Nov-11 21:46:24)
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How did these compare with your speedtests, at about same time?
1999: Freeserve 48K Dial-Up => 2005: Wanadoo 1 Meg BB => 2007: Orange 2 Meg BB => 2008: Orange 8 Meg LLU => 2010: Orange 16 Meg LLU => 2011: Orange 17 Meg Untweaked 19 Meg Tweaked WBC
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i get full speed all day
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You mean 6.6 Meg all day? Am not talking about your Sync speed.
1999: Freeserve 48K Dial-Up => 2005: Wanadoo 1 Meg BB => 2007: Orange 2 Meg BB => 2008: Orange 8 Meg LLU => 2010: Orange 16 Meg LLU => 2011: Orange 17 Meg Untweaked 19 Meg Tweaked WBC
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yes all day.
i download alot, so monitor it quite a bit
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the guy from earlier with the 2200 download, has sent me his latest download speed, and its just the same (11:30pm)
dont know what router he has, so will msg him, and see if he can tell me, so i can maybe ask you guys how to get his line stats
he isnt tech savy at all so i would imagine him to have a talktalk router (i use netgear)
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How to get your router line stats
1999: Freeserve 48K Dial-Up => 2005: Wanadoo 1 Meg BB => 2007: Orange 2 Meg BB => 2008: Orange 8 Meg LLU => 2010: Orange 16 Meg LLU => 2011: Orange 17 Meg Untweaked 19 Meg Tweaked WBC
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yes all day.
i download alot, so monitor it quite a bit
Is that P2P ?
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yes all day.
i download alot, so monitor it quite a bit
Is that P2P ?
no downloading program updates, streaming, etc
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yes all day.
i download alot, so monitor it quite a bit
Is that P2P ?
no downloading program updates, streaming, etc
Ok, in that case you will be fine.
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ok, update.
been to his just now, and logged into his router, and his stats are as follows
adsl2+
interleaved
down 2573 up 774
snr margin down/up 6.0/6.0
attenuation down/up 42.5/30.5
it was at this point he told me he has had no voice service for quite some time, reported it, but they said it was not their fault, whatever that means.
anyway, explains why he has a slow speed
would you say this is anything for me to worry about?
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Poor thing! Your neighbour has wiring issues. He should be getting > 8 Meg Sync.
You don't need to worry about this. You have a much shorter line then him, 32 dB attn vs. his 42.5 dB, and should get much faster speeds.
1999: Freeserve 48K Dial-Up => 2005: Wanadoo 1 Meg BB => 2007: Orange 2 Meg BB => 2008: Orange 8 Meg LLU => 2010: Orange 16 Meg LLU => 2011: Orange 17 Meg Untweaked 19 Meg Tweaked WBC
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i hope not, i have ordered it this morning, completion in 17 days
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Let us know how you get on.
1999: Freeserve 48K Dial-Up => 2005: Wanadoo 1 Meg BB => 2007: Orange 2 Meg BB => 2008: Orange 8 Meg LLU => 2010: Orange 16 Meg LLU => 2011: Orange 17 Meg Untweaked 19 Meg Tweaked WBC
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will do
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ok, all connected up
looking good
namesco speed test, Download Speed: 11745 kbps (1468.1 KB/sec ) Upload Speed: 827 kbps (103.4 KB/sec )
ping of 58ms
Channel: FAST, Upstream rate = 1020 Kbps, Downstream rate = 13232 Kbps
Link Power State: L0
Mode: ADSL2+
Channel: Fast
Trellis: U:ON /D:ON
Line Status: No Defect
Training Status: Showtime
Down Up
SNR (dB): 6.2 13.4
Attn(dB): 33.0 11.6
Pwr(dBm): 0.0 12.8
Max(Kbps): 15448 1056
Rate (Kbps): 13232 1020
so far so good
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Spot on! As predicted
1999: Freeserve 48K Dial-Up => 2005: Wanadoo 1 Meg BB => 2007: Orange 2 Meg BB => 2008: Orange 8 Meg LLU => 2010: Orange 16 Meg LLU => 2011: Orange 19 Meg WBC
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just had a speed bump, by getting my snr profile changed from snr12 to snr9, and if it stays stable, then they are going to try the snr6
SNR (dB): 3.4 12.5
Attn(dB): 32.5 15.3
Pwr(dBm): 0.0 12.8
Max(Kbps): 17208 1128
Rate (Kbps): 14656 1020
downloads at 1571 KB/s
coming from 860 KB/s on upto 8mb product i am very happy
Edited by deleted (Sat 31-Dec-11 09:30:33)
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Your current SNR is 3.4dB though?
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i guess they are just making sure its stable at the new profile.
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Shouldn't it be 9?
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If TT set NM at 9 dB and it's actually running at 3.4 then there's about 6 dB of excessive noise, just as there was when they set it to 12 
1999: Freeserve 48K Dial-Up => 2005: Wanadoo 1 Meg BB => 2007: Orange 2 Meg BB => 2008: Orange 8 Meg LLU => 2010: Orange 16 Meg LLU => 2011: Orange 19 Meg WBC
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i can only assume the snr9 profile is upto 9.
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If TT set NM at 9 dB and it's actually running at 3.4 then there's about 6 dB of excessive noise, just as there was when they set it to 12
does this mean it running at 3.4 is bad? i assumed the lower the better?
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i can only assume the snr9 profile is upto 9. I think it is the target SNR when you resync the modem. It may subsequently rise or fall depending on line noise.
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The closer to the Target SNRM (what your ISP calls a SNR Profile) the better!
The speed is set according to the Target. The Target SNRM is a buffer (hence Margin) into which the noise can rise. If the noise eats too much into this buffer, it will disconnect.
1999: Freeserve 48K Dial-Up => 2005: Wanadoo 1 Meg BB => 2007: Orange 2 Meg BB => 2008: Orange 8 Meg LLU => 2010: Orange 16 Meg LLU => 2011: Orange 19 Meg WBC
Edited by XRaySpeX (Sat 31-Dec-11 12:33:26)
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got myself another speed boost
now on the 6db profile
downloading at 1729 KB/s
ADSL Link Downstream Upstream
Connection Speed 16227 kbps 1020 kbps
Line Attenuation 32.0 db 15.3 db
Noise Margin 0.9 db 11.8 db
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Puzzling!
Your speeds fit your reported NMs rather consistently, but your NM is always about 6 dB below what TT say is your profile.
Are you sure that TT are talking about the same thing or you haven't misunderstood what TT means by "profile"?
1999: Freeserve 48K Dial-Up => 2005: Wanadoo 1 Meg BB => 2007: Orange 2 Meg BB => 2008: Orange 8 Meg LLU => 2010: Orange 16 Meg LLU => 2011: Orange 19 Meg WBC
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i was on 24ISNR12
now i am on Profile Name 24ISNR6
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now i am on Profile Name 24ISNR6 So that is upto 24 Mbps downstream, with a target SNRM of 6 dB and interleaving applied.
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100% Linux and, previously, Unix.
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So why is he running with NM of 1 dB? And not just that but always 5 to 6 less than his Profile?
1999: Freeserve 48K Dial-Up => 2005: Wanadoo 1 Meg BB => 2007: Orange 2 Meg BB => 2008: Orange 8 Meg LLU => 2010: Orange 16 Meg LLU => 2011: Orange 19 Meg WBC
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Are you tweaking your router's NM by -6dB? That's what these figures are consistent with.
1999: Freeserve 48K Dial-Up => 2005: Wanadoo 1 Meg BB => 2007: Orange 2 Meg BB => 2008: Orange 8 Meg LLU => 2010: Orange 16 Meg LLU => 2011: Orange 19 Meg WBC
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i am running a DGteam firmware on my router
its been on at that speed now for 12 hours, and no disconnects
interleaving is NOT on
Edited by deleted (Thu 05-Jan-12 08:03:15)
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Grrrr!
How could you conceal an obvious related fact and waste all our time!
I was wrongly concentrating on the usual suspect, noise, when all the time it was an straightforward forced tweak of NM. DGT remembers tweaks between reboots.
1999: Freeserve 48K Dial-Up => 2005: Wanadoo 1 Meg BB => 2007: Orange 2 Meg BB => 2008: Orange 8 Meg LLU => 2010: Orange 16 Meg LLU => 2011: Orange 19 Meg WBC
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I did not conceal it, i merely forgot i had it, as i did it when i first bought the router early last year.
i only mentioned it as someone on the talk talk forum asked if i had a DGteam firmware on it. so thought i should mention it here.
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interleaving is NOT on Then your previous statement is not correct -- now i am on Profile Name 24ISNR6 Please make your mind up and tell us the facts. I do know exactly what each TalkTalk profile setting entails.
We cannot assist when you use guesswork or wishful thinking. A TalkTalk profile described as " 24ISNR6" sets the line to upto 24 Mbps downstream, with Interleaving turned on and a target SNRM of 6 dB.
If you do not want interleaving for your line, you should request your profile to be set as " 24FSNR6".
Not only have you had a Grrrr! from XRay but now you also have a black look from a grumpy burakkucat!
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100% Linux and, previously, Unix.
Edited by burakkucat (Thu 05-Jan-12 17:37:54)
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I'd suggest that now you are on a 6db profile that you should reset your SNR percentage in the DGTeam settings to 100% and monitor how low your SNR drops below 6db in order to work out the optimal percentage should you wish to drop below 6db.
What is clear is that what you have it set to now is too low, because 0.9db is way too low and not a large enough margin IMHO. You may even start getting slower than optimal speeds (due to packetloss) and instability, especially if the SNR drops further still (which is reasonably common overnight, for example) which sooner or later will drop sync and resync at a slower speed to compensate anyway.
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And what's the point of OP telling us his TT Profile when he is overriding it and not informing us?
Re: Interleaving ON or not: I think OP is confused by this line of his router stats: "Channel: Fast". My Netgear does the same; always this line whether Interleaving ON or not. Only sure way to check is the Depth line: "D 1 1" for Fast Path or "D >1 >1" for Interleaving (depth).
1999: Freeserve 48K Dial-Up => 2005: Wanadoo 1 Meg BB => 2007: Orange 2 Meg BB => 2008: Orange 8 Meg LLU => 2010: Orange 16 Meg LLU => 2011: Orange 19 Meg WBC
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Exactly. 
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100% Linux and, previously, Unix.
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wow, sorry if i upset anyone, but come on guys calm down.
all i was doing is showing my speeds, and how pleased i am that i went with talk talk to get this.
whether i have interleaving on, get my acronyms wrong, is not an issue.
you have to remember i have come from an upto 8mb product in a small village, i never thought i would ever see these speeds.
and as i say i was not concealing that i was using DGteam, i had forgot i had it, and that i had the snr tweaked as this was done when i got the router quite a while ago.
again sorry if i upset anyone.
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I will get upset if you were referring to me - you hadn't upset me . I stand by my advice to you in that if you are running the SNR that low (0.9dB), although your sync speed is faster, that doesn't necessarily mean the actual data throughput on the connection will be faster - as I said, it could be slower, and dropped packets may stall data transfer too. You'd probably be better off relaxing that SNR a bit to give you at least a 3dB margin - the sync speed will drop, of course, but it will probably make your connection more stable and decrease the likelyhood of dropped packets, therefore increasing the actual throughput speed. Just a bit of friendly advice.
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Your advice was admirable . Trouble is OP is so taken up with his steadily increasing Sync speeds that he is overlooking his steadily decreasing dangerously low NMs which he has brought upon himself and shrugged aside our warnings about it .
1999: Freeserve 48K Dial-Up => 2005: Wanadoo 1 Meg BB => 2007: Orange 2 Meg BB => 2008: Orange 8 Meg LLU => 2010: Orange 16 Meg LLU => 2011: Orange 19 Meg WBC
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i haven't shrugged them aside, i have increased my margin.
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OK, good, so what are your stats now?
1999: Freeserve 48K Dial-Up => 2005: Wanadoo 1 Meg BB => 2007: Orange 2 Meg BB => 2008: Orange 8 Meg LLU => 2010: Orange 16 Meg LLU => 2011: Orange 19 Meg WBC
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still very stable
so how do i check if its interleaved or not? i assumed when it said fast in my router that was interleaved off, is this not correct?
ADSL Link Downstream Upstream
Connection Speed 14356 kbps 1020 kbps
Line Attenuation 32.0 db 15.3 db
Noise Margin 4.1 db 11.8 db
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Well, you said you were on 24ISNR6, which is an interleaved profile. Your upstream speed kinda confirms that - on a fast profile the max is usually 1019 kbps. If you do a traceroute to bbc.co.uk, for example, the time taken between your router and the first hop is also a good indicator. Interleaved should be 20-30ms (around 15ms slower than fast).
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so how do i check if its interleaved or not? How did you get the stats here http://forums.thinkbroadband.com/talktalk/t/4067214-... ? Which you've since ceased using. By Telnet or DGTeam?
Well do the same and look further down for 2 lines starting "D:". Then 1 indicates Fast or >1 is Interleaved Depth.
Are you still tweaking NM? Cuz it's 2dB below par
There seems no doubt your line is stable and giving expected speeds. All you need to do is either leave it at the TT 6dB Profile or tune it slightly, by no more than -3 dB, to go a bit faster without having the NM too low.
1999: Freeserve 48K Dial-Up => 2005: Wanadoo 1 Meg BB => 2007: Orange 2 Meg BB => 2008: Orange 8 Meg LLU => 2010: Orange 16 Meg LLU => 2011: Orange 19 Meg WBC
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yes its still tweaked a little
is this the D your talking about?
Channel: FAST, Upstream rate = 1020 Kbps, Downstream rate = 14356 Kbps
Link Power State: L0
Mode: ADSL2+
Channel: Fast
Trellis: U:ON /D:ON
Line Status: No Defect
Training Status: Showtime
Down Up
SNR (dB): 3.8 12.1
Attn(dB): 32.0 15.3
Pwr(dBm): 0.0 12.4
Max(Kbps): 16976 1116
Rate (Kbps): 14356 1020
G.dmt framing
K: 249(0) 146
R: 6 0
S: 1 1
D: 64 1
ADSL2 framing
MSGc: 52 10
B: 248 145
M: 1 1
T: 2 1
R: 6 0
S: 0.5538 4.5447
L: 3683 257
D: 64 1
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this is the email that talk talk sent me from their forum reply
Downstream Rate 17495 kb/s
Upstream Rate 1020 kb/s
Downstream SNR 0.1 dB
Upstream SNR 12 dB
Downstream Attenuation 32 dB
Upstream Attenuation 15.3 dB
ADSL Mode ADSL2+
Profile Name SI_6_24M
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Yes D: 64 1 = Interleaved (on down) to depth of 64.
1999: Freeserve 48K Dial-Up => 2005: Wanadoo 1 Meg BB => 2007: Orange 2 Meg BB => 2008: Orange 8 Meg LLU => 2010: Orange 16 Meg LLU => 2011: Orange 19 Meg WBC
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