Latency seems to have increased? Packet Loss and spikes

Hi all.

I am currently with Zen and have been using their internet since May which has been good with low latency and Ping, but I have noticed the latency has doubled and fluctuates a lot with some heavy packet loss.

Here is an example taken sometime in June

12th June BQM

After it stayed like that till the 15th June and then returned to levels I was used to. Before returning I got a lot of packet loss as well.

15th June BQM

It has now doubled again and i am not sure if this is normal or if I should go back and ask them to investigate? This is my first time using an openreach connection

In reply to a post by HighwindX:

Hi all.

I am currently with Zen and have been using their internet since May which has been good with low latency and Ping, but I have noticed the latency has doubled and fluctuates a lot with some heavy packet loss.

Here is an example taken sometime in June

12th June BQM

After it stayed like that till the 15th June and then returned to levels I was used to. Before returning I got a lot of packet loss as well.

15th June BQM

It has now doubled again and i am not sure if this is normal or if I should go back and ask them to investigate? This is my first time using an openreach connection

Lots of reports both on this forum and elsewhere about Zen (and those ISPs buying their backhaul) suffering as Zen try and load-balance the throughput on their London and Manchester gateways if you don't mind researching a bit further.

Have you had a GEA migration I wonder? I know it won't be something you asked for, but please check if it has been done?

log into Zen, My Account, My Orders (bottom left), Order History - you will see something like below if you have been migrated:

Zen FTTP GEA Migration
zenxxxxx@zen Fulfilled on 21/03/2022 £0

Anyone else with similar issues, please check, and post if you have been migrated.

I checked my account, following your instructions and can't see any record of a migration.

What else should I do to check what's going on? I am also searching to see what other issues people are having based on what @GonePostal mentioned.

Is it possible I have been routed to Manchester? How can I check?

In reply to a post by HighwindX:

I checked my account, following your instructions and can't see any record of a migration.

What else should I do to check what's going on? I am also searching to see what other issues people are having based on what @GonePostal mentioned.

Is it possible I have been routed to Manchester? How can I check?

By performing a Tracert to any we address Run box type cmd and then type tracert and the web address you want to find out the route taken The 1st hop after your router will have man in its dns name if you are routed via Manchester data centre

In reply to a post by tommy45:

In reply to a post by HighwindX:

I checked my account, following your instructions and can't see any record of a migration.

What else should I do to check what's going on? I am also searching to see what other issues people are having based on what @GonePostal mentioned.

Is it possible I have been routed to Manchester? How can I check?

By performing a Tracert to any we address Run box type cmd and then type tracert and the web address you want to find out the route taken The 1st hop after your router will have man in its dns name if you are routed via Manchester data centre

Thank you.

Looks like I am being routed to Manchester:

Tracing route to dns.google [8.8.8.8]
over a maximum of 30 hops:

1 <1 ms <1 ms <1 ms Main Router
2 78 ms 48 ms 75 ms lo0-0.bng3.wh-man.zen.net.uk [51.148.77.130]
3 25 ms 19 ms 19 ms lag-7.p2.wh-man.zen.net.uk [51.148.73.14]
4 19 ms 135 ms 19 ms lag-3.p1.thn-lon.zen.net.uk [51.148.73.136]
5 19 ms 19 ms 19 ms lag-1.br1.thn-lon.zen.net.uk [51.148.73.153]
6 20 ms 19 ms 19 ms 72.14.223.28
7 19 ms 19 ms 19 ms 209.85.249.187
8 19 ms 19 ms 19 ms 142.251.52.143
9 19 ms 18 ms 20 ms dns.google [8.8.8.8]

Trace complete.

I'll see about them changing it back.

Edited by HighwindX (Sat 25-Jun-22 09:38:15)

Thanks HighWindX, it could all be related though, but I am not sure. Please look at the "Slow Speeds after GEA migration" forum - I am disgusted to see that Zen only 'guarantee' 450Mbps form 900Mbps service (that's across the board to all FTTP packages actually). Something is going wrong there.

I am in Cheshire, and my tracers is below:

steve@Steves-Mac-mini ~ % traceroute 8.8.8.8
traceroute to 8.8.8.8 (8.8.8.8), 64 hops max, 52 byte packets
1 fritz.box (192.168.1.254) 0.796 ms 0.364 ms 0.230 ms
2 lo0-0.bng4.wh-man.zen.net.uk (51.148.77.131) 5.252 ms 5.456 ms 5.181 ms
3 lag-8.p2.wh-man.zen.net.uk (51.148.73.118) 12.983 ms 12.746 ms 12.767 ms
4 lag-3.p1.thn-lon.zen.net.uk (51.148.73.136) 11.647 ms 11.989 ms 11.205 ms
5 lag-1.br1.thn-lon.zen.net.uk (51.148.73.153) 11.872 ms
lag-2.br2.thn-lon.zen.net.uk (51.148.73.155) 11.839 ms
lag-1.br1.thn-lon.zen.net.uk (51.148.73.153) 12.413 ms
6 72.14.223.28 (72.14.223.28) 11.262 ms
72.14.217.190 (72.14.217.190) 11.407 ms 11.688 ms
7 * 74.125.242.97 (74.125.242.97) 13.282 ms
74.125.242.65 (74.125.242.65) 12.918 ms
8 209.85.241.93 (209.85.241.93) 11.702 ms
172.253.66.89 (172.253.66.89) 13.274 ms
216.239.63.219 (216.239.63.219) 13.389 ms
9 dns.google (8.8.8.8) 12.921 ms 11.138 ms 11.180 ms
steve@Steves-Mac-mini ~ %

BUT I am NOT using the Zen GEA migration, I am back on BTW
I note that I am going via lo0-0.bng4.wh-man.zen.net.uk (51.148.77.131)
not 78 ms 48 ms 75 ms lo0-0.bng3.wh-man.zen.net.uk [51.148.77.130] you are going through....
No idea if that matters

Edited by SteveBushell999 (Sat 25-Jun-22 09:53:50)

It's not something they allow customers to change. I and others have reported it before on this forum and tried complaining to zen.

All zen customers every time they establish a connection end up with the possibility of being put on either of the two gateways. Every time your connection drops you may end up seeing a gateway switch and the disparity between the two gateways seems quite large. It's meant to be determined by which responds first but i'm not convinced. A member of zen did state they were going to improve it but i'm not sure if that has been carried out or not yet.

You could try dropping your session a few times to see if it flicks you to the other one.

In reply to a post by SteveBushell999:

I am disgusted to see that Zen only 'guarantee' 450Mbps form 900Mbps service (that's across the board to all FTTP packages actually). Something is going wrong there.

Disgusted? Really?

Openreach guarantee Zen 110Mb/s.
How can Zen guarantee you more than 450Mb/s? It's a good guarantee for what your pay.

It's a contended, budget, home broadband service. If you want better than a 450Mb/s guarantee then it's going to cost much more than Zen charge.

BT offer a to little higher guarantee in some areas, the same as Zen in other areas.