I've swapped myself back to the GEA/on-net connection now at the request of Zen to properly test it out (For now, I can always swap back to port 2 on the ONT should anything go wrong...).

Sadly I need fixed IP referencing a domain, so that wouldn't work for me in any case..

Yes, it's a proper mess, start to finish for sure, and whilst I'm happy we both have some sort of working 'solution', the reason (root cause analysis) still isn't clear, nor am I in any way convinced that we have alleviated the problem for anyone else really.

how it has been handled by OR

It is still very far from proven that OR/BTW are the demons here, from my perspective, with myopic vision, switching off GEA migration fixed the problem, but a wider view is that the entirety of that migration was not tested, and that seems to be at Zen's front door doesn't it?

It's also far from 'fixing' the other people's problems who have been affected, sure we've been the ones that have carried the torch, but other poor souls are still coming out of the woodwork.

In reply to a post by SteveBushell999:

It's also far from 'fixing' the other people's problems who have been affected, sure we've been the ones that have carried the torch, but other poor souls are still coming out of the woodwork.

If it turns out to really be a card issue within the OR equipment do we really think OR will be proactively going around replacing other cards where other Users may be affected (could be any ISP) or do we think the most likely outcome will be they sit on their hands and wait for end users/ISPs to prove they have an issue on the OR equipment as I just can't see that happening.

The latter is more likely i would imagine.

At this time, all we know is that the GEA line appears to be working properly after OR did something. Zen claim not to have changed anything and yet now it's all working...

Sounds like an OR problem to me.

I'm not tearing my hair out trying to piece together some jigsaw though. There's no point as it's not like I have the knowledge to properly interrogate all parties if I wanted to... I just have to believe what I'm told by Brandon et al. in Zen.

I don't envy their task now... They'll need to carry on working with OR to work out why this has happened

I think if I was Zen, I would be asking OR if Steve's head end exchange needed a new card for the Zen cable link and if so is it from the same batch as your's as that would at least create a clear link between your two issues.

In reply to a post by dect:

In reply to a post by SteveBushell999:

It's also far from 'fixing' the other people's problems who have been affected, sure we've been the ones that have carried the torch, but other poor souls are still coming out of the woodwork.

If it turns out to really be a card issue within the OR equipment do we really think OR will be proactively going around replacing other cards where other Users may be affected (could be any ISP) or do we think the most likely outcome will be they sit on their hands and wait for end users/ISPs to prove they have an issue on the OR equipment as I just can't see that happening.

Presumably OR would now need to work with their L2S switch supplier and confirm the existence of the issue, and whether it pertained to a single card, a handful or indeed a larger batch of cards. I have no idea what their warranty/support arrangements are with their vendors - so it may fall to the switch vendor to replace said cards under warranty.

The last few posts are all fair, and attempting to find the real cause of the problem, to get towards the root cause etc, but......

As we know, the service is supplied by Zen, and we have no direct visibility of OR problems, they all present as 'Zen' - that's the way it works, WE don't speak to OR do we?

Given that this problem has been there for at least 3 months, the only people able to clobber OR and complain are Zen, why the reticence? Is it like when I was with BT the onus was on me to ensure my equipment was snowy white or I would be charged a fortune for BT to visit and make their equipment WORK?!!!

Something has really gone wrong here, but the crux of the matter is in my second paragraph, the ONLY place we can go to get a fix is to Zen, and that just isn't working, for whatever reason. I do have huge sympathy for Zen in this situation, but please, WHY is the answer to my issues (for example) to put me back to OR from a GEA migration when the real villain is OR? That feels 100% counter-intuitive?

Someone needs to start wielding a huge stick......

In reply to a post by SteveBushell999:

but please, WHY is the answer to my issues (for example) to put me back to OR from a GEA migration when the real villain is OR? That feels 100% counter-intuitive?

Nobody has put anyone "back to OR". That's not how it works. They are all Openreach GEA connections.
Same OLT, likely same L2S, both property of OR.
It's beyond the L2S that the line was changed from BT Wholesale GEA backhaul to Zen GEA backhaul, then changed back to BT Wholesale again.

There's no avoiding the Openreach OLT & L2S on an Openreach GEA FTTP connection.

I think you miss the point! The overall responsibility is with Zen, NOT OR (as far as supply of service to US is concerned).

In addition, everyone seems to want to assume that they understand the problem from the tiny crumbs of evidence we have, but in reality, we are still totally in the dark, and in that respect you may be right, we still have no official line.

The simple fact is (I emphasise again) that the 'supplier' here is Zen, OR / BTW whatever, are a sub-supplier, and overall responsibility is therefore with the primary supplier.

Edited by SteveBushell999 (Wed 29-Jun-22 09:15:49)

John, do you have any links to helpful diagrams about how this all hangs together to make it easier for people to understand?

It’s all covered in SIN 506

https://www.openreach.co.uk/cpportal/content/dam/cpp...