Fibre Broadband and FTTPoD

Hi all reading this!

So I am currently stuck with roughly 7 mbps download speed on Fibre broadband at my household. This is due to the distance I am from the cabinet. I recently checked BT Wholesale ADSL checker and FTTPoD is now available and I was wondering if anyone knew how much it did cost to get this installed for roughly 2 KM of overhead cables through a field (I know no one will be able to give me an accurate guess but some sort of idea would be appreciated). I am also curious about the max downstream as it seems an error was made when editing it haha. Thank you all and the link is below.

https://imgur.com/a/dFucl48

Edited by deleted (Sun 18-Nov-18 20:55:28)

See this current thread. I'm surprised you haven't read it already .

What is curious about the downstream maximum speed? On FTTP and FTTPoD your sync speed is not "up to" anything. It is the speed on the label. 330/30 is the speed Openreach have available for your line.

9 months ago I was pretty much in the same situation as you, and I got a quote for FTTPoD when the new pricing structure came into play and ended up in the 39K club, needless to say I did not proceed.

Anyway, 9 months further on and Openreach have installed FTTP (not the On Demand product) all on there own, so for me it turned out to be a case of waiting patiently. From what I am seeing it does appear that Openreach are starting to actively in-fill areas that can't/won't be further supported by FTTC technology.

FTTPoD only recently became available but I doubt they themselves would bring it to my area even though we don't benefit at all from FTTC as some companies like BT advertise standard broadband to be faster. There are only a few houses near me as we are quite remote

I have followed the FTTPoD thread from the start but the signal to noise ratio is very low and I don't think it contains any information comparing underground with overhead.

Maybe I'm being naive but I would have thought overhead had fewer unknowns than underground (blocked ducts, cost of digging / traffic management etc) so it must surely be possible to say overhead cost X plus Y per meter.

Edited by deleted (Mon 19-Nov-18 09:08:43)

https://imgur.com/a/hsBRjgl

Yeah that was kind of what I had in mind, I mean the phone line just goes through some fields but then it also goes up a bit of a footpath however I do get my quote soon so I will let you known.

Single premises seemingly a kilometre from next nearest property have seen native FTTP appear, so it can happen, whether it will depend a lot on what the BDUK project in your area is doing and what its target coverage levels are...

i.e. hitting target is more important than helping a specific individual

In reply to a post by martynp1:

Yeah that was kind of what I had in mind, I mean the phone line just goes through some fields but then it also goes up a bit of a footpath however I do get my quote soon so I will let you known.

So you have already asked for a quote.

And from your previous reply to me, you didn't mean the "maximum" speed you queried in your OP, which did appear to be your not understanding FTTP, you meant the observed maximum achieved on FTTC, two months ago. That is almost certainly a sync you did obtain.

Thanks for starting a thread which is a complete waste of time .

I am very lost and my whole point of this was to seek advice I don't need you telling me it is a waste of time because if you don't have anything helpful to say, please don't say it as it makes me waste time replying to you rather then thanking someone for their help. I was wondering if anyone reading might have had a similar order who went a head with a full survey and how much that was. I also had a question about why BT Wholesale had a maximum speed somewhere on that list of 8000 or something stupid. Please go spend your time on something else as I won't need your input from here.

Thanks,

Martyn

Edited by deleted (Mon 19-Nov-18 14:35:23)

I understand that, thank you for your help so far MrSaffron !

In reply to a post by martynp1:

I was wondering if anyone reading might have had a similar order who went a head with a full survey and how much that was.

Get your free desktop quote first. Your final price is very likely to be under 75% of this; there is a three-quarters chance it will be under 57%.

So once you have your free quote, you can decide whether it's worth paying for the full survey.

In reply to a post by candlerb:

Get your free desktop quote first.
�
So once you have your free quote, you can decide whether it's worth paying for the full survey.

He already did, before starting the thread .

In reply to a post by martynp1:

I do get my quote soon so I will let you known.

You seem to think you have a rough idea how long the distance the fibre feed needs to go.
From where are you basing this estimate?

Pricing is not from the fibre at the FTTC cabinet but from the nearest Fibre Aggregation Node. Usually 3 or 4 cabinets are a served by a single Agg Node.
This means your run could be all the way from an Agg Node based near the 3rd or 4th closest FTTC cabinet, considerably further than your local FTTC cabinet.

In rare cases (especially very rural) there is no Agg Node at all serving some FTTC cabs, increasing likely quotes even further.

FTTPoD can be very expensive for the very rural.

Edited by j0hn83 (Mon 19-Nov-18 15:39:01)

In reply to a post by RobertoS:

He already did, before starting the thread .

I know. What I'm saying is: wait for the result of the quote first. There is very little point speculating on the final build cost when you don't even know the desktop cost.

In effect I said that to him, and got a very rude reply .

Note also what he says about the "Highest observed VDSL speed", after I had explained what it was. What he finds "stupid" about it he hasn't said.

The thread has no point, and has now also wasted your time too .

Thank you for this helpful information candelrb! My English isn't great so when you say under 75% you mean that the actual survey price if I were to pay for it would be a lot cheaper or more expensive, once again sorry for my bad understanding.

I apologies if it sounded harsh, I was not 100% sure what you meant as I am not great at English however when someone says I have wasted time by asking a question on a forum please don't keep wasting it by replying. Move on to something that would consume your time in a better way.

Nobody here can give you any clue at all what the cost to you will be. There was little point in asking. As you said, the relevant thread contains an awful lot, but contains everything that we know. In summary of it, the answer is that every case is very different.

The only way you will get a useful answer is by getting both the desktop survey result, (I assume that is what you have requested), then even if that is high pay up for the full survey which gives you a price that is frequently much lower, but sometimes higher.

As for your calling the VDSL2 maximum observed speed "stupid", no it isn't. But I accept it clearly shows the Kbps figure, not the Mbps figure stated. That will be because the descriptive text is fixed, and doesn't cater for figures being quoted in Kbps because they are below 1Mbps.

Alright my apologies I was only trying to gain an understanding.

In reply to a post by martynp1:

Thank you for this helpful information candelrb! My English isn't great so when you say under 75% you mean that the actual survey price if I were to pay for it would be a lot cheaper

If you pay for a survey, the final quote is almost always cheaper than the desktop quote. By "under 75%" I mean if your desktop quote was £10,000 you are likely to pay £7,500 or less.

Follow the link I gave to a spreadsheet which summarises the results in this forum for about 20 quotations which went to full survey.

And I was a bit harsh in return, so sorry for that. But really, nobody has a clue what quote you will get.

What we do know is that since this new quoting system came in, most people who have then paid for the £250 (+ Vat?) proper survey have had a final quote thousands of pounds lower. A few have had high full survey quotes.

Thank you for the link it helped a lot, seems like the desktop survey can sometimes be hit and miss.

Gotcha, well if they quote in the £30000 it would be a strange one because it does seem hit and miss so it could possibly go to £12000 or stay close to £30000. Just a gamble really isn't it ?

Well ive been having a nightmare since having my FTTPoD fitted 2 weeks ago. Since day one it has only had speeds of 150-225 download even though the BT guy said i should see my max speeds being so close to the agg node/splitter and the exchange being lett than 500m from my house.
Anyway the BT engineer was not experienced with fibre at all and had to work off a printed paper tutorial to follow the steps and was shaking so bad trying to get the fibre terminated inside the house that i was sure he was going to mess it up.
In the end he showed me the light meter which read just shy of 14db or something along those lines and he said it was a brilliant reading.

So i have been in touch with Cerberus the same day it was fitted who at first said there was no problems and everything was fine, checked my router etc etc

I then looked online and noticed of people complaining of backend/capacity issues with openreach and put this forward to Cerberus who came back with

" We have escalated this issue with BT and after a series of checks from their side there seems to be a capacity issue on BT�s backhaul network. This is being investigated further at senior management level and I will keep you informed with the progress of this issue. "

and then

" Once again I apologise for the inconvenience this issue is causing you. We have received an update on this issue. BT will be configuring additional capacity and will move you to that link this week. We have not received a confirmation of estimated completion but I shall let you know once we get more information on this matter "

and finally today i have had this

" Once again I apologise for the inconvenience this issue is causing you. We have received an update on this issue. BT will be configuring additional capacity and will move you to that link this week. We have not received a confirmation of estimated completion but I shall let you know once we get more information on this matter. "

Shouldnt have Openreach upgraded the backend to account for me going full FTTP at the exchange seeing as i was paying for it ?

What is involved with what they have said ?

In reply to a post by martynp1:

Gotcha, well if they quote in the £30000 it would be a strange one because it does seem hit and miss so it could possibly go to £12000 or stay close to £30000. Just a gamble really isn't it ?

Yes. If they quote £30K, the chances are reasonable that the final price will be around £15-18K. And if you'd be prepared to pay £15K for fibre, then a £250 gamble is relatively small change.

In my gut I feel like it is probably going to be somewhere around there and I have to think do I pay 15-18K to make 2 children be able to play fornite and download games in peace and let my wife watch netflix or do I make them suffer a bit more haha. Anyway we will see what the desk survey quotes and take it from there.

Distance to the aggregation node and splitter is totally irrelevant, it only becomes an issue if joints/splices are so bad that light levels are very low and that is easily tested and would mean no data rather than reduced TCP speeds.

Without knowing the exchange it is hard to say much, slow throughput may be the backhaul at the local exchange or could be within the remit of Cerberus

If the bit about BT Wholesale increasing capacity is true, then this is rare but not unknown, i.e. the virtual path you are on may be sized too small without seeing a speed test graph it is hard to say e.g. if you are bursting to 300 Mbps then it may be there are a couple of you fighting over a 300 Mbps virtual path.

Backhaul is not down to Openreach, it is down to BT Wholesale or whatever arrangement an ISP has at the exchange for picking up data from the handover

The Exchange is SHAW in Oldham.

Also it has never burst to or anywhere near 300mb.

Apparently the OR engineer said i was the first locally to have FTTP connected.

Thanks

In reply to a post by xtremedetailz:

the BT guy said i should see my max speeds being so close to the agg node/splitter and the exchange being lett than 500m from my house.

The "BT guy" was telling you porkies, as unlike copper line services, FTTP/FTTPoD is not distance dependant. So if you pay for a 330 Mbps service then you will get that speed (minus overheads) at all times, assuming there's no backhaul/exchange congestion.

In reply to a post by xtremedetailz:

Shouldnt have Openreach upgraded the backend to account for me going full FTTP at the exchange seeing as i was paying for it ?

Whether you have paid £39000 in installation costs for FTTPoD or lucky enough to have been given it for zero or minimal costs (native FTTP), both services at the exchange receive the same priority, ie you still have to share the bandwidth with other FTTP users.

I had my FTTPoD line installed in June 2017 (though not with Cerberus), for the first 14 months or so I got 310 Mb/s day & night, 7 days a week. However a month or two ago, i saw slow downs at peak times where the speeds went down to ~ 100 Mbps. My ISP raised this with their carrier (BT Wholesale) who put me on a different SVLAN path at the exchange which fixed this and speeds are now back to 310 Mbps at all times. So if its congestion, BTW putting you on a different SVLAN at the exchange will probably fix this but you haven't said if you're getting the full (~ 300 Mbps) speeds at certain times of the day. With congestion, you line will still hit max line speeds at quiet times, eg at 3am or 8am on a Sunday.

Edit: just seen your "Also it has never burst to or anywhere near 300mb" comment. This suggests BTW/Openreach/Cerberus may not have correctly configured your line rather than congestion issues.

Edited by deleted (Mon 19-Nov-18 18:49:06)

In reply to a post by baby_frogmella:

In reply to a post by xtremedetailz:

the BT guy said i should see my max speeds being so close to the agg node/splitter and the exchange being lett than 500m from my house.

The "BT guy" was telling you porkies, as unlike copper line services, FTTP/FTTPoD is not distance dependant. So if you pay for a 330 Mbps service then you will get that speed (minus overheads) at all times, assuming there's no backhaul/exchange congestion.

In reply to a post by xtremedetailz:

Shouldnt have Openreach upgraded the backend to account for me going full FTTP at the exchange seeing as i was paying for it ?

Whether you have paid £39000 in installation costs for FTTPoD or lucky enough to have been given it for zero or minimal costs (native FTTP), both services at the exchange receive the same priority, ie you still have to share the bandwidth with other FTTP users.

I had my FTTPoD line installed in June 2017 (though not with Cerberus), for the first 14 months or so I got 310 Mb/s day & night, 7 days a week. However a month or two ago, i saw slow downs at peak times where the speeds went down to ~ 100 Mbps. My ISP raised this with their carrier (BT Wholesale) who put me on a different SVLAN path at the exchange which fixed this and speeds are now back to 310 Mbps. So if its congestion, BTW putting you on a different SVLAN at the exchange will probably fix this but you haven't said if you're getting the full (~ 300 Mbps) speeds at certain times of the day. With congestion, you line will still hit max line speeds at quiet times, eg at 3am or 8am on a Sunday.

when doing speedtests using everyone i can think of i have never seen above 225mb download off peak and during peak is around 100-150mb.

also my upload has remained at 30-31mb regardless of the time of day.

i have also noticed my ping is higher than i was expecting at around 18ms and to the same server with my Virgin connection around 8ms. in fact every server i choose the ping is much lower from virgin over my new FTTPOD service.

In that case I would make it very clear to Cerberus that you're not seeing max line speeds at any time of the day.

Re; ping times/latency, it largely depends on your geographical location. Many people wrongly assume that FTTP guarantees you single digit ping times - it doesn't!! I'm in the Scottish Highlands and getting roughly ~20 ms on FTTP, on FTTC i was getting ~ 22 ms. You will only get single digit ping times if you live in/near London as most ISP data centres are in Central London.

Also on latency it may that the new ISP is not optimal if lowest latency is what you want.

A good FTTC line can be as low as 8 ms for the VDSL2 part, so FTTP is not going to make more than a few ms impact on that, i.e. the FTTP means zero or 1ms latency is a bit of an urban myth

You may well be the first

Run a speed test at https://www.thinkbroadband.com/speedtest and post the link to the results, the graphs will help to show if this is a congested virtual path versus a mis-configured one that you are the only occupant of

The first of anything is always the one breaking the ground, so more likely to uncover things like this

Also if you haven't done so already, can you hook up your PC directly to the ONT LAN port & measure speeds that way? This will rule out router issues. You may need to setup a PPPoE connection on your pc.

Another thing is to try a completely different PC and/or OS.

I have seen laptops running Windows which can only achieve 150Mbps over ethernet, but run Linux on them and you can get 940M on a gigabit link. The poor performance under Windows is probably down to crummy drivers from the NIC vendor.

If you know someone who has a Mac with gig ethernet (or thunderbolt to gigabit adapter) that's also a good comparison.

I just went through the spreadsheet and saw Band B (£1,800) on old pricing, but no ducts between property and aggregation node. Does this mean a duct is needed and would reduce the price or ?

In reply to a post by MrSaffron:

You may well be the first

Run a speed test at https://www.thinkbroadband.com/speedtest and post the link to the results, the graphs will help to show if this is a congested virtual path versus a mis-configured one that you are the only occupant of

The first of anything is always the one breaking the ground, so more likely to uncover things like this

Link HERE

In reply to a post by baby_frogmella:

Also if you haven't done so already, can you hook up your PC directly to the ONT LAN port & measure speeds that way? This will rule out router issues. You may need to setup a PPPoE connection on your pc.

I have been through those trouble shooting issues with Cerberus and done exactly that using 2 different routers and connecting directly and setting up PPPoE on my Pc and also tried another computer with a 10gb port with the same results.

In reply to a post by candlerb:

Another thing is to try a completely different PC and/or OS.

I have seen laptops running Windows which can only achieve 150Mbps over ethernet, but run Linux on them and you can get 940M on a gigabit link. The poor performance under Windows is probably down to crummy drivers from the NIC vendor.

If you know someone who has a Mac with gig ethernet (or thunderbolt to gigabit adapter) that's also a good comparison.

I have tried both my Ubiquiti EdgeRouter 4 and my custom build Pfsense router both with the same results.

And also tried using a Intel 4 port gigabit NIC connected to my main computer as well as the onboard intel gigabit and the aquantia 10g port.

I have also found that I am quite the artist. Here is a map of what annoys me a lot but I know that nothing in terms of cabinets can be done.

https://imgur.com/a/hkr5UQx

Edited by deleted (Mon 19-Nov-18 22:21:39)

In reply to a post by martynp1:

I have also found that I am quite the artist. Here is a map of what annoys me a lot but I know that nothing in terms of cabinets can be done.

https://imgur.com/a/GYhvn6R

Your map means diddly squat because it doesn't show the location of your nearest aggregation node, which are U/G chambers to which FTTP lines and FTTC cabinets connect to. Maps/locations of agg nodes are NOT available to the public. As every FTTPoD build is bespoke (unique), you're better off waiting for the desktop survey quote for FTTPoD to get a rough idea of costs and then proceeding to the full survey if you're serious about ordering. Otherwise you are just speculating, unless you can get hold of Mystic Meg.

Edited by deleted (Mon 19-Nov-18 22:28:58)

I know it just makes me laugh seeing as how 30 seconds down the road they are fine but we have to travel to somewhere in the distance for our FTTC connection. I did speak with another chap just up the road and he is interested in FTTPoD as well so if this quote comes back and I pay for the survey would he have to take a survey too ?

Cabinet 8 certainly looks more use to you than cabinet 2. The possibly fortunate thing for your FTTPoD quote is that you are perhaps nearer cabinet 8's aggregation point than the other one. They will normally quote from the nearest aggregation point to you, not necessarily your cabinet.

Fingers crossed.

Edit: If you are running a business it can be possible to obtain a £2,500 voucher/subsidy.

Don't get your hopes up high with the next bit. Others from that other thread know far more than I do. Wait for what they post about it.

I don't know whether the reduction of £700, plus £50 per premises passed, if there are any, (which IIRC you only know with the full survey results) applies to just business FTTPoD buyers, or also to individuals. So the 8-9 properties would probably get one fibre distribution point with eight ports, with you using one. So maybe a nice reduction will be available.

Edited due to incorrect info re the £700, see candlerb�s post.

Edited by RobertoS (Tue 20-Nov-18 10:00:24)

So looks like the old 330 Mbps down and 30 Mbps service and possibly someone has setup a virtual path wrong thus limiting download to around 200 Mbps

Thanks Roberto, I hope it is more use. However new overhead poles would have to be installed as I don't think any run in my direction from that location. Is this added into the cost if it were to come from that area?

As for a business we do have one with a website that is ran from home but it really is nothing big at all. I doubt this would get the £2,500 subsidy.

I appreciate the help thus far!

In reply to a post by RobertoS:

I don't know whether the reduction of £700 per premises passed (which IIRC you only know with the full survey results) applies to just business FTTPoD buyers, or also to individuals. So the 8-9 properties would probably get one fibre distribution point with eight ports, with you using one. So maybe a nice reduction will be available.

Actually it's a single discount of £700 per Passive Optical Network (i.e. splitter), plus £50 per property passed. Those discounts will already be included in your post-survey quotation.

In reply to a post by martynp1:

However new overhead poles would have to be installed as I don't think any run in my direction from that location. Is this added into the cost if it were to come from that area?

How can you say new poles would have to be installed when you don't even know where the agg node is? How do you know there aren't any u/g ducts from the agg node heading towards your area? Openreach, where possible, will try to route the new fibre cabling along your existing copper route, whether thats A/G or U/G. So if your copper line comes on O/H poles to your home, theres a very good chance Openreach will use the same poles for fibre. Likewise if you're served by U/G copper. The question is, how much of the existing route Openreach will utilise, ie at which point would the fibre branch off to the agg node? Only Openreach can answer that. As for the costs involved wrt poles/ducts, again only Openreach can answer that. You're asking questions which no-one on these forums can answer...I would ask these questions to the Openreach Surveyor who does the survey, that's assuming you go ahead with the full survey.

Edited by deleted (Tue 20-Nov-18 08:36:29)

As far as we can tell:

* if the FTTPoD route requires new ducts or poles, you pay for them
* if the FTTPoD route re-uses existing ducts, but they are blocked, OpenReach will unblock them at their expense

We can't even be 100% sure of that: the final quotation doesn't give you an itemised cost breakdown, just a total price.

But there have been several reported cases where duct blockages were found after the final quotation was raised and the FTTPoD install charge paid. These cause delays, but charges are not passed on: that is, OpenReach stick to the quoted cost, even if it turns out to be more work than they were expecting.

In reply to a post by candlerb:

We can't even be 100% sure of that: the final quotation doesn't give you an itemised cost breakdown, just a total price.

Which is why the OP should be patient and wait for the desktop survey quote and potentially a proper survey. Ordering FTTPoD isn't like buying something from a shop, there are too many variables involved & every build is priced on a bespoke basis.

Thanks for the clarification candlerb . That post edited, for future readers.

Edited by RobertoS (Tue 20-Nov-18 10:01:26)

Alright thank you for the clarification.

Thanks for the reply baby_frogmella. This is very true that I do not have any idea but I defo will ask the Openreach Surveyor if I do go ahead.

Post deleted by R0NSKI

At 6 - 7 Mbps I'd think there's a fair chance that your postcode (think I found the right one) will see a further BDUK/Connecting Cumbria upgrade to native FTTP at some point in the not too distant future. Generally, if your FTTC speed is below 24Mbps, especially if there's other addresses beyond yours with even worse speed, then the area might well be in scope.

You can try asking Connecting Cumbria direct and/or asking your local MP what he knows (believe he's already got involved in other (nearby) areas).

Also, if you post your postcode here others 'in the know' might give you a hint what Openreach has planned. If nothing comes of that you might want to consider the 'Community Fibre Partnership' approach if you've got neighbours keen to improve their connections rather than FTTPoD

In reply to a post by candlerb:

As far as we can tell:

* if the FTTPoD route requires new ducts or poles, you pay for them
* if the FTTPoD route re-uses existing ducts, but they are blocked, OpenReach will unblock them at their expense

We can't even be 100% sure of that: the final quotation doesn't give you an itemised cost breakdown, just a total price.

But there have been several reported cases where duct blockages were found after the final quotation was raised and the FTTPoD install charge paid. These cause delays, but charges are not passed on: that is, OpenReach stick to the quoted cost, even if it turns out to be more work than they were expecting.

I was told by the surveyor that blocked ducts were the responsibility of OR and he was told not to look for them when preparing the quote.

In reply to a post by AL66:

At 6 - 7 Mbps I'd think there's a fair chance that your postcode (think I found the right one)

I know I found the right postcode. IIRC there are nine properties .

I would guess that the agg node for both cabinets is near Clappersgate as they are fed from the headend at Ambleside and there is only one route in, so probably about 2.5km to the OP.
There is a possibility of an infil cabinet but that maybe some way off.

Ummm. Thanks. Not good news for the OP though.

Still, he was expecting 2km, so it could have been worse.

The area does seem to be somewhat sparsely populated .

Thanks for the reply, I did actually email them about 2 months ago but never got a reply, that was connecting cumbria.

Hi there, I am really sorry but what is OP? It is probably very simple but I am quite stupid with technical terms.

When you say 2.5km is that what sort of distance I might be looking at?

LA22 9HQ is the postcode Covers quite a large area.

OP = Opening post, or Opening poster, depending on context .

Witchunt's guesses tend to be rather accurate .

It's been about 8 days since I asked for a desk survey so shouldn't be too much longer however near Clappersgate about 300m down the road I did see a telephone pole with a circular shaped object on which didn't look like the usual copper square box on a telephone pole. Don't know if its fibre related just thought I'd throw this out there.

In reply to a post by martynp1:

LA22 9HQ is the postcode Covers quite a large area.

But only ten addresses on the Openreach database. Which of them are on your branch off the A593 I can't tell.

Edited by RobertoS (Tue 20-Nov-18 18:55:58)

Clappergate would make sense for the aggregation node looking at my maps of the area

2.5km may be a slight under estimate, depends how much the path wiggles on the way, I'd have said 3km

Probably just a copper joint, the aggregation node is in a pavement chamber.

Splitters can be pole mounted but would be a green rectangular metal box, but believe aggregation nodes are always stuck in the ground

Should I brace for a beefy price?

Expect £30k and when less you can be pleasantly pleased

The standard poles if it were to come from that area stop around Nanny Brow I am pretty sure and then from there it is empty until you get to the right bend and head away from River Brathay where a modern weird electricity pole is by itself ?

And that means what?

None of your attempting to second guess where and how they will build the network will tell you what price you will get quoted.

I just didn't know what is was I thought it might be a pole that they could use if it even comes from that area.

AFAIK the green rectangular metal boxes are deprecated, newer installs use TM node enclosures which are oval black plastic - large / extra large in chambers only, small / medium on poles or in chambers.

Fantastic area that, had a week's holiday very close by in Chapel Stile a couple of years ago.

Oh yes the scenery is beautiful, lovely houses as well. The only downside is the broadband but when you come back from a long week of work, just amazing.

Dear all, thank you all so very much for taking your time to help me with my questions I had about this post. Cerberus got back to me saying this below:

https://imgur.com/a/fTEpL4s

I do not think I will go ahead with a full survey as this has been emailed to me:

https://imgur.com/a/uePdsaV

I have kept in touch with Mr Sharpe (the man who sent the email seen above) and he said he is going to inform me of the price and depending on it Openreach could cover some and I cover the rest however this is just an idea.

Once again thank you all so very much!

Martyn

Too bad.

You could pay the £250+VAT to find out, but so far I've only seen one person go ahead with full survey when OR said they could not give an initial desktop quote - and they got a final quote of £21,540+VAT.