In reply to a post by baby_frogmella:

In reply to a post by BLaZiNgSPEED:

Because I am 800 meters from Bishopsgate Exchange. That would mean in theory I would only get maximum 28Mbps which is pointless.

Are you on an EO line? If so, then if you were to get FTTC, Openreach would most likely build a new AIO cabinet which would not be located inside your exchange. However as you are quite close to your exchange already, Openreach may decide to plonk the new cabinet directly outside the exchange - as they have done at some exchanges, eg NSIMD.

Yes I am on EO Line as I have mentioned that previously. That's also what BT Openreach told me via email 4 months ago.
Here's the quote from the email below.

"Please accept our apologies for the delay in responding.

I've had a look into this for you and can see that your property is connected directly from the (BISHOPSGATE) exchange, without going through a green cabinet. This is called an �exchange only line'.

Sadly, Exchange only lines are one of the small numbers of properties we can't currently provide fibre to. However, the good news is that there is an ongoing project to divert your line through a traditional green cabinet, which will allow you to order fibre broadband once completed.

But, as I'm sure you'll appreciate, installing fibre is a technical complex civil engineering project. When we plan fibre jobs we have to take into account all aspects of the work required and give realistic timescales, so with this in mind we can't give you any completion dates just yet."

This doesn't make much sense to me. Because if they aren't going to install FTTC now, when? After another 5 years? Which would of-course deem FTTC useless by then because BT will have to focus their attention on revamping their FTTP project.

Furthermore I also don't see economical sense to install another green cabinet temporarily for FTTC and then few years later when FTTP comes to remove the green cabinet again as it will no longer be needed for FTTP.

That is why I am highly sceptical about FTTC coming either. It hasn't come for years. I have more hope for Hyperoptic if one day I manage to acquire wayleave consent from the building authority. There are several buildings around within 5 minutes off my property that have Hyperoptic but don't even have FTTC from BT OR.

I think BT OR are confused between whether to install FTTC or FTTP. They are probably still thinking. But thinking will only delay things further. Because the checker has been saying for years since 2012 if I can remember, area on a plan to be upgraded with Superfast fibre but works haven't been started. Then 4 months ago it was changed to plan for FTTP only for it to be reverted back to Superfast. That's just very unprofessional from a big corporate company like BT.

Because I am 800 meters from Bishopsgate Exchange. That would mean in theory I would only get maximum 28Mbps which is pointless.

Can you explain what theory you think means you will get 28Mbps maximum at 800m.

My 1022m long line currently synced at 44Mb would disagree with that. I had 55/11 at 1 point before crosstalk chipped away at my line.

FTTC is not a temporary solution, as once you have it, it means Openreach have installed a NGA fibre aggregation node in your area - usually not too far away from the FTTC cab. This makes it easier for Openreach to deploy faster G.Fast and/or FTTP services in the future and also FTTPoD if you're willing to pay.

There's a good chance you're going to get decent speeds (>30 Mbps) in the future through Openreach, but unless you're willing to pay (eg leased line or FTTPoD) you have no say in the type of technology Openreach will bring to your doorstep - it will be down to economics.

Edited by deleted (Thu 26-Jul-18 14:19:25)

In reply to a post by j0hn83:

Because I am 800 meters from Bishopsgate Exchange. That would mean in theory I would only get maximum 28Mbps which is pointless.

Can you explain what theory you think means you will get 28Mbps maximum at 800m.

My 1022m long line currently synced at 44Mb would disagree with that. I had 55/11 at 1 point before crosstalk chipped away at my line.

Yes, take a look at this link. https://www.thinkbroadband.com/guides/fibre-fttc-ftt...
Scroll down a bit to where it says. What speed can I expect from fibre broadband? (FTTC/VDSL2)

800m 28 Mbps 10 Mbps 80%

I'm going to say it's not just a question of getting a speed. It's a question of whether the line can cope with that speed. For example noise margin issues.

Here where I live in a high rise building for years I have had issues with drop-outs when the connection speed is higher. If I get a speed test of 15-16Mbps the router stats noise margin will dramatically drop to 3.0dB and if it drops to below 0.9dB the connection will disconnect. Within a couple of days or so the internet will drop out. When the internet speed is lowered to 11-12Mbps and the noise margin jumps to 9-10dB then my connection is stable and can go on for weeks without a single drop-out.

In reply to a post by baby_frogmella:

FTTC is not a temporary solution, as once you have it, it means Openreach have installed a NGA fibre aggregation node in your area - usually not too far away from the FTTC cab. This makes it easier for Openreach to deploy faster G.Fast and/or FTTP services in the future and also FTTPoD if you're willing to pay.

There's a good chance you're going to get decent speeds (>30 Mbps) in the future through Openreach, but unless you're willing to pay (eg leased line or FTTPoD) you have no say in the type of technology Openreach will bring to your doorstep - it will be down to economics.

But pure fibre optic promises to resolve uncertainties relating to speed and reliability. For example FTTP is unaffected by weather interference�s. Having and demanding fibre is not just about better internet speeds, it�s also about having a more reliable connection. FTTC is not something I wish for, it�s a bottleneck because A) you don�t get speeds higher than 80 Mbps, like with FTTP that delivers 1Gbps and B) The risks of connection drop-outs continue to carry through thanks to the copper wire.

BT Openreach have to spend more money on maintaining this copper network that will from time to time break down for whatever reasons such as water logged damaged cables, rats, noise margins, line problems, etc.

Also the problem is even if FTTC or GFast allow for 24+ to 300Mbps many lines cannot cope with the speed due to poor noise margins. The higher the speed, the lower the noise margin. If noise margin drops below 1db the internet will dropout. Along with heavy rain which also causes the internet to drop thanks to outdated copper wire.

So my question is what will happen to that FTTC cab in future once people with FTTC get upgraded to FTTP? From my understanding people with FTTP have their cable travelling directly to their doorstep without going through a green cabinet.

Those are incredibly low estimates and suggest you need to be 150m to get 80Mb sync. You can get 80Mb at double that distance.

Because I am 800 meters from Bishopsgate Exchange. That would mean in theory I would only get maximum 28Mbps which is pointless.

Distance to the exchange is irrelavent for FTTC. You should be worrying about the distance to the cabinet instead. I dont think they are that stupid to spend a ton of money just to get 28mbps.

You seem to be jumping the gun and automatically assuming the worst case scenario for FTTC. Yes, there are some people who are on long FTTC lines with poor quality copper. But for people like you living in central London, you will almost certainly get decent FTTC speeds as I can't imagine Openreach putting the cabinet 2 miles away when you are only 800m away from the exchange. Worst case scenario they will install your new FTTC cabinet outside the exchange so 800m away on FTTC will still give you respectable speeds. You really need to wait to see where OR install your FTTC cabinet before jumping to wild conclusions - that's assuming you are getting FTTC rather than FTTP.

Also, I would bet my house even if you were to get FTTC, Openreach would still bring FTTP to you sooner than many other people on FTTC purely due to you living in Central London which Openreach have prioritized along with other major city centres in their recently announced 'Fibre First' program.

Let's be honest here. They are never going to place a cabinet outside Bishopsgate exchange to serve properties 800m away. If anything, they are more likely to install an internal cabinet in a basement area.

In reply to a post by baby_frogmella:

Also, I would bet my house even if you were to get FTTC, Openreach would still bring FTTP to you sooner than many other people on FTTC purely due to you living in Central London which Openreach have prioritized along with other major city centres in their recently announced 'Fibre First' program.

Well going by areas covered by my Exchange which most of it had FTTP hardware installed but was just never enabled dating back 2011 - 2012 where most of those areas ended up getting FTTC, however they did leave all the FTTP hardware in place as far as I could see when I was last about.
You can still see this on Google Maps.

So if BTOR did the same back then in other areas of London, it probably wouldn't take them that long to get them to FTTP.

Paul

In reply to a post by Sammm_:

Because I am 800 meters from Bishopsgate Exchange. That would mean in theory I would only get maximum 28Mbps which is pointless.

Distance to the exchange is irrelavent for FTTC. You should be worrying about the distance to the cabinet instead. I dont think they are that stupid to spend a ton of money just to get 28mbps.

I'm well aware that it is the distance to the cabinet that I should be worried about. Perhaps I may have been mistaken or thought that the Bishopsgate Exchange is where the cabinet was located. Hence why I thought that was the 800m distance to cab. But I guess I am not fully informed of that.

Indeed OR won't be that stupid to install a new green cabinet that is too further away from my property or else it would just be futile.

In reply to a post by baby_frogmella:

You seem to be jumping the gun and automatically assuming the worst case scenario for FTTC. Yes, there are some people who are on long FTTC lines with poor quality copper. But for people like you living in central London, you will almost certainly get decent FTTC speeds as I can't imagine Openreach putting the cabinet 2 miles away when you are only 800m away from the exchange. Worst case scenario they will install your new FTTC cabinet outside the exchange so 800m away on FTTC will still give you respectable speeds. You really need to wait to see where OR install your FTTC cabinet before jumping to wild conclusions - that's assuming you are getting FTTC rather than FTTP.

Also, I would bet my house even if you were to get FTTC, Openreach would still bring FTTP to you sooner than many other people on FTTC purely due to you living in Central London which Openreach have prioritized along with other major city centres in their recently announced 'Fibre First' program.

I can only hope that living in Central London would mean me getting FTTP before the rest the country. But then again I still think it's going to take few to many years. Fibre First aims to get 3 million FTTP by end of 2020. There are other external factors such as wayleave that may delay the process much further than anticipated. 3 million by 2020 is actually still quite small if you were to add 100% of all premises from all 8 urban cities where BT OR will be investing. And there's no promise that I'll be one of those fortunate ones to be included in their area. Given that BT OP will not fully cover the entire Bishopsgate Exchange by 2020 it would suggest that there is a potentially longer delay awaiting.

My frustration with current building authority last 3 years not making an agreement with Hyperoptic shows how progress can be slowed down to such a halt. Under a different building authority I would've had Hyperoptic supported by now and wouldn't have cared less about BT's OR FTTC or FTTP.

So if wayleave doesn't get sorted out then BT OR will most likely settle with FTTC which of-course I am assuming worst case scenario because other than FTTP, FTTC/G.Fast would be the second best upgradeable choice.