In reply to a post by PhilipD:

Seems to be a few surveys coming in over the original estimate recently. Did they give a break down of the costings?

Yes they did;
A breakdown of the charges is below:

Labour: £6,310.00
Stores: £3,555.00
Contract Labour: £0.00
Civils: £4,098.00
Civils Stores: £0.00
Tree cutting: £0.00
BT Connection Charge: £495.00
Deductions:
-£250.00
-£750.00

£13,458.00
Pricing valid for 28 days. Excludes VAT.

In reply to a post by PhilipD:

Do you have any neighbours that would contribute informally to the costs?

Not that I know off, We've recently moved there, I'll ask them, but most of them are non technical and happy with 30-40mbit VDSL

Interestingly... (all ex vat)
Leased line comes out at £323 / month with £0 install
FTTPoD comes out at £10958 (with the gigabit voucher)

Total Cost (i.e. install + year's service) between the two
FTTPoD starts to be cheaper from year 5
Taking out a 5 Year loan to cover the install

Makes FTTPoD £26 / month cheaper than Leased line (year 1), and £48 / month cheaper (year 2-5), and £245 / month cheaper (year 6 onwards)
This assumes that FTTP prices stay the same, and that Leased Line prices stay the same,
Checking OR's Ethernet pricing (https://www.openreach.co.uk/orpg/home/loadQQ.do) it's £140 / month for the connection from the Exchange to my house, leaving ~ £90 a month for backhaul and internet access.

So... with a business loan, even with the interest, it's cheaper to just go FTTPoD to the tune of ~ 10% 1st Year
20% 2nd-5th Years
80% thereafter.

Yes I'm taking that risk on the 4th and 5th years that BT might role out open Reach, but as GigaClear won the contract for my area, It seems unlikely to me (given that they very nicely skipped my road)

Thanks for advice all

In reply to a post by dect:

No point putting a 12 port on a pole if only 3 properties can be served by it.

Indeed, although it seems they're happy to run cables from the CBT across several poles if needed.

In my case, there are only two properties on "my" pole (by my front garden). There are three more on the pole across the road with the 12-port CBT on it, then more up the road.

Here's the layout in my case - Os are poles, X is where the fibre cable comes up from the ground and Y is where the CBT is. The numbers show how many houses connect to each pole. My pole is at the bottom-right.

3        2        3  
X========O========Y
          \       |
           \      |
         O==O     O
         3  3     2

There are 4 more properties not visibly connected to any pole, presumably via an underground connection somewhere.

At the time, I was given a discount based on 7 properties passed. When the first set of Openreach installers came along, they said they planned to fibre-up the whole street as a result of my order, although as there are only 12 ports for 20 houses some folks will miss out!

Edited by deleted (Tue 21-May-19 12:30:45)

In reply to a post by rclare89:

Interestingly... (all ex vat)
Leased line comes out at £323 / month with £0 install
FTTPoD comes out at £10958 (with the gigabit voucher)

Total Cost (i.e. install + year's service) between the two
FTTPoD starts to be cheaper from year 5
Taking out a 5 Year loan to cover the install

Makes FTTPoD £26 / month cheaper than Leased line (year 1), and £48 / month cheaper (year 2-5), and £245 / month cheaper (year 6 onwards)
This assumes that FTTP prices stay the same, and that Leased Line prices stay the same,
Checking OR's Ethernet pricing (https://www.openreach.co.uk/orpg/home/loadQQ.do) it's £140 / month for the connection from the Exchange to my house, leaving ~ £90 a month for backhaul and internet access.

So... with a business loan, even with the interest, it's cheaper to just go FTTPoD to the tune of ~ 10% 1st Year
20% 2nd-5th Years
80% thereafter.

Yes I'm taking that risk on the 4th and 5th years that BT might role out open Reach, but as GigaClear won the contract for my area, It seems unlikely to me (given that they very nicely skipped my road)

Thanks for advice all

I've just been in contact with a few brokers.

So far, on a 100/100 connection they are 270+vat/month over three years on a 100Mb bearer.

However, one said the voucher scheme could only be used on the monthly costs, if you had the same speeds but on a Gigabit bearer, which with the voucher brings costs to 285/month +vat.

I may have wrongly assumed the voucher could be used whatever.

Update for my survey, desktop quote was £8300 and confirmed build charge is £7702 (ex VAT prices), this includes the deduction for the survey and a further deduction for properties passed of £950.00. Originally it was only 5 passed but I think that discount includes more properties?

Need to think about it, I should be able to use the voucher scheme for £2500 towards the cost, and it will still work out cheaper than a leased line after a couple of years, but still more than I was hoping.

In reply to a post by Retron:

Indeed, although it seems they're happy to run cables from the CBT across several poles if needed.

In my case, there are only two properties on "my" pole (by my front garden). There are three more on the pole across the road with the 12-port CBT on it, then more up the road.

Here's the layout in my case - Os are poles, X is where the fibre cable comes up from the ground and Y is where the CBT is. The numbers show how many houses connect to each pole. My pole is at the bottom-right.

3        2        3  
X========O========Y
          \       |
           \      |
         O==O     O
         3  3     2

There are 4 more properties not visibly connected to any pole, presumably via an underground connection somewhere.

At the time, I was given a discount based on 7 properties passed. When the first set of Openreach installers came along, they said they planned to fibre-up the whole street as a result of my order, although as there are only 12 ports for 20 houses some folks will miss out!

Would be interesting to see what properties (and how many of them) are now showing as FTTP enabled in your road, those that are fed underground may now be enabled by a hidden CBT in a footway box.

In reply to a post by E300:

this includes the deduction for the survey and a further deduction for properties passed of £950.00. Originally it was only 5 passed but I think that discount includes more properties?

Yes, that will be 19 properties passed @ £50.

So I thought I would join the party.
My desktop quote came back today as: onsite survey required.
Estimated distance to fibre aggregation node 200-399m.

My exchange is Bridge (NDBRI), which according to SamKnows has FTTP in some areas, though I have no idea where.
My FTTC cab is right outside the exchange (moved from EO line to cab many years ago). I'm pretty sure my phone line is underground all the way (though I might take another walk to check - all the houses on my road are 1960s type builds). Straight line distance to exchange is apparently 258m, though my FTTC speeds are about 40/10 - which I think suggests longer or [censored] copper (aluminium?). I'll probably pay for the site survey out of curiosity, but has anyone got any thoughts on likely costs? Would they put fibre underground along the same path as my copper effectively? Could the aggregation node be back at the FTTC cab / exchange?

Hi

It's really hard to second guess the likelyhood of costs as we as customers don't have all the information.

The aggregation node could be anywhere, the exchange distance or the FTTC cabinet location can be completely irrelevant.

For FTTP on Demand Openreach need to run a fibre optic cable all the way from the aggregation node to your property. If you are lucky, the aggregation may happen to be at or very close to your FTTC cab, this means it can follow the same route as you telephone cable which is close to that as well (at the PCP), this can allow reusing the existing overhead and/or underground ducting route.

If the the aggregation node is somewhere else, which is quite likely, a brand new route for that fibre run has to be created, this could mean digging up hundreds of metres of pavement/roads to run the fibre to you.

Regardless of the route, and with properties from the 60s, the telephone cable may be directly buried in the ground, so even if the fibre can follow the same route to you as your telephone cable, it will all need digging up and new ducting laid. If it is in ducting, that ducting may be in poor condition and blocked in many places and can't be used easily.

So us mere mere mortals guessing at a cost just isn't possible, given BT can't even give a desktop quote and require a survey, means we have no chance

All you can do is ask for the survey and take a chance.

Regards

Phil

In reply to a post by Deft:

My desktop quote came back today as: onsite survey required.
Estimated distance to fibre aggregation node 200-399m.
Straight line distance to exchange is apparently 258m

If the distance to agg node estimate is accurate ( from the above info it might be the agg node is located just outside the exchange) and its a relatively simple route, then expect build costs to be less than £10k, or if you're lucky, less than £5k. But of course you need a survey done to get this confirmed.

Openreach will always try to make use of their existing u/g or a/g infrastructure first, so you may find the fibre is laid along the same copper route, partially at least.