In reply to a post by j0hn83:

Talktalk need to be in the copper exchange to provide a voice service.
Only the fibre goes to the head end.

Talktalk's residential FTTP service has no voice component.

"Faster Fibre 150" = G.fast (copper, with voice)
"Faster Fibre 150 without voice" = FTTP (without voice)
"Faster Fibre 500 without voice" (ditto)

Ref: https://www.thinkbroadband.com/news/8899-talktalk-fi...

However, it's possible their ordering systems are broken, and refuse orders from FTTP properties just because they are not in LLU footprint. If you want the service, try ordering over the phone. Ask for "Future Fibre" which is their marketing name for Openreach FTTP - as distinct from all the other so-called "Fibre" services they offer.

In reply to a post by ft247:

I wonder what class of optics Openreach are using and how conservative they're being with power budgets.

My 2 year old Huawei ONT (HG8110H) in Suffolk is a Class B+ device...good for 20km and 32 splits in the PON according to the specs for Class B+

In reply to a post by j0hn83:

Vodafone are a little different.

They also sell Gigafast FTTP over the CityFibre network.
They have taken the deliberate decision to only sell OpenReach FTTP in specific areas, areas where CityFibre FTTP isn't available.

It appears I can order Vodafone over my FTTP connection but CityFibre now have Phase 1 coverage over the same Openreach exchange area (EAIPS) in Ipswich.

We are well removed from the direct CF coverage area in town, but it does make me wonder then in places where there is overbuild between the two wholesale networks whether Vodafone will then only sell over Openreach in preference to CityFibre (or vice versa)?

In reply to a post by Pheasant:

We are well removed from the direct CF coverage area in town, but it does make me wonder then in places where there is overbuild between the two wholesale networks whether Vodafone will then only sell over Openreach in preference to CityFibre (or vice versa)?

Almost certainly they'll sell CityFibre. CityFibre's business model is to undercut Openreach on pricing, so there will be a better margin on CityFibre.

Also, CityFibre allows its resellers to provide higher upload speeds - making their service more attractive compared to the Openreach-based competitors.

Milton Keynes is a good example of substantial overlap between the two.

In reply to a post by candlerb:

In reply to a post by Pheasant:

We are well removed from the direct CF coverage area in town, but it does make me wonder then in places where there is overbuild between the two wholesale networks whether Vodafone will then only sell over Openreach in preference to CityFibre (or vice versa)?

Almost certainly they'll sell CityFibre. CityFibre's business model is to undercut Openreach on pricing, so there will be a better margin on CityFibre.

Also, CityFibre allows its resellers to provide higher upload speeds - making their service more attractive compared to the Openreach-based competitors.

Milton Keynes is a good example of substantial overlap between the two.

Presumably in Ipswich they continue to offer Gigafast over Openreach FTTP where that is the only option.

However where an alternative exists or becomes available - that is where CityFibre have overbuilt to properties passed by Openreach FTTP - are you saying they then proactively connect via CityFibre or only 'offer' CityFibre?

As far as I know Vodafone offered Openreach FTTP (basically this year) well after CityFibre were known to be building over the entire city and surrounds.

That is somewhat contradictory to John83's earlier statement "They have taken the deliberate decision to only sell OpenReach FTTP in specific areas, areas where CityFibre FTTP isn't available."

In reply to a post by Pheasant:

However where an alternative exists or becomes available - that is where CityFibre have overbuilt to properties passed by Openreach FTTP - are you saying they then proactively connect via CityFibre or only 'offer' CityFibre?

I don't know whether they will migrate existing customers proactively from one platform to the other, but they certainly could if the numbers add up. One possibility is that they could wait until each customer comes to contract renewal time (new contract guarantees cost recovery). A bigger case is whether they migrate their existing FTTC customers to CityFibre FTTP.

As for why they decided to sell Openreach FTTP in an area where Cityfibre is planning to build: I could only speculate. Maybe Openreach made them an offer they couldn't refuse. Maybe they are desperate to get new customers as quickly as possible, via any route available.