In reply to a post by jchamier:

Lots of people would like to buy a reliable 80/20 without any distance issues.

I agree - my point is that if you have a good FTTC line and aren't in an FTTP Priority/Stop Sell area, then the FTTP 80/20 will cost you more for not much benefit.

It will be interesting to see how pricing develops as more stop sells come into effect. Vodafone for example are offering cheap 80/20 FTTP in Salisbury, the same price as they would normally charge for FTTC.

In reply to a post by candlerb:

FTTC signals operate at higher frequencies, which are more affected by attenuation over distance. So there comes a cross-over point, when you are a mile or two from the cabinet, where FTTC becomes worse than ASDL. Although both are pretty slow by that point

That is true, so maybe they are right. when I last spoke to them, they were saying about using 4G, I don't know if they have, this is not the same person from the first post,, just someone I chat to on Discord now and again,

This is true: although for most providers FTTC and ASDL are priced identically, having a worse service sucks.

I suspect the original provider is getting rid of their ADSL equipment from exchanges, due to so few people still using it.

FTTC is priced the same to start with, and then they stick the prices up after the contract, and you have to go through all the hassle of dealing with them again to get the price down.
this is one thing I hate about broadband. It was far easier in the dial-up days, just use who you want when you want.

In reply to a post by Pheasant:

Just to clarify in case folks are confused, there are currently 2 Stop Sell programmes under way:

1. FTTP Priority Exchange Stop Sell
2. WLR Withdrawal Stop Sell

Your exchange area will no doubt be in the former category - unless you are in Mildenhall in Suffolk, in which case it’s already happening!

Case 1 is withdrawal of copper entirely; case 2 is only withdrawing analogue voice (PSTN), which is happening much more widely. In the second case, if you order a "phone line" you'll get either FTTP or SOGEA (copper FTTC/ADSL broadband), and your voice service will be digital voice delivered over any of those technologies.

Unfortunately, even Openreach's own documentation is inconsistent.
https://www.openreach.com/locations/mildenhall
says: "On 4 May 2021 we stopped selling copper broadband services in the Mildenhall area."

But
https://www.openreach.com/content/dam/openreach/open...
says that Mildenhall is a SOGEA transition.

In reply to a post by candlerb:

Case 1 is withdrawal of copper entirely; case 2 is only withdrawing analogue voice (PSTN), which is happening much more widely. In the second case, if you order a "phone line" you'll get either FTTP or SOGEA (copper FTTC/ADSL broadband), and your voice service will be digital voice delivered over any of those technologies.

Unfortunately, even Openreach's own documentation is inconsistent.
https://www.openreach.com/locations/mildenhall
says: "On 4 May 2021 we stopped selling copper broadband services in the Mildenhall area."

But
https://www.openreach.com/content/dam/openreach/open...
says that Mildenhall is a SOGEA transition.

Yes wording inconsistencies aside, for folks outside of the FTTP Priority Exchange Stop Sell areas (some 383 exchange areas so far) - the national stop sell date for WLR (PSTN) is the first key date, which is September 2023, roughly 2 years away. No more ordering 'new' copper line with dial tone after that. if you don't have FTTP outside then it will be one of the SOGEA, SOGfast or SOTAP, non-dial tone products only.

The second key date is of course the full withdrawal of PSTN two years later in 2025 (if they stick to schedule). No more dial tone from the socket after that.

Full copper withdrawl is probably more than a decade away. But by 2026 if you believe the dates, we should be "All IP"

I have a very decent 80/20 line now but for most people they just wouldn't be able to implement the hardware and settings to achieve this. I only pay a total of £35/pm for this including the line with BT.

BQM graph

Takeaway is that for most people WFH at least, a FTTP connection is a better option as you do not need to worry about QoS /AQM to be able to utilise a connection without audio/video dropouts when the kids are streaming etc.

Edited by smouty (Mon 16-Aug-21 10:40:51)

I'm in the north west of Ireland (Derry/Londonderry) - been on FTTP now almost 3 weeks and its been rock solid - my FTTC was rock solid too - due to a short line.

Main advantage is the lowest ping to bbc/google etc I've seen is 15ms - compared to 18ms with FTTC.

In reply to a post by BuckleZ:

I'm in the north west of Ireland (Derry/Londonderry) - been on FTTP now almost 3 weeks and its been rock solid - my FTTC was rock solid too - due to a short line.

Main advantage is the lowest ping to bbc/google etc I've seen is 15ms - compared to 18ms with FTTC.

Does ping really matter unless you are playing games? Ok, really high pings are annoying, but to be honest, I have never had a problem with pings and getting Google to load 3 milliseconds faster is not going to make a difference. I doubt you can even blink your eye in that time.

I have plenty of time to decide, but it seems the advantages is mainly speed, with maybe more reliability for some people. I will tell that to the lad at work when I see him.

In reply to a post by zyborg47:

In reply to a post by BuckleZ:

I'm in the north west of Ireland (Derry/Londonderry) - been on FTTP now almost 3 weeks and its been rock solid - my FTTC was rock solid too - due to a short line.

Main advantage is the lowest ping to bbc/google etc I've seen is 15ms - compared to 18ms with FTTC.

Does ping really matter unless you are playing games?

Low ping is a big help when gaming but as you say 3ms isn't going to make the slightest bit of difference even if some deluded gamers would have you believe it does.


.

Edited by Jack_Hackett (Mon 16-Aug-21 18:28:11)

In reply to a post by BuckleZ:

I'm in the north west of Ireland (Derry/Londonderry) - been on FTTP now almost 3 weeks and its been rock solid - my FTTC was rock solid too - due to a short line.

Main advantage is the lowest ping to bbc/google etc I've seen is 15ms - compared to 18ms with FTTC.

I get <7ms on FTTC.
I have switched to Stadia over Xbox for gaming and for a streaming service it is as responsive as playing natively on a PC or console.

Edited by smouty (Mon 16-Aug-21 19:09:17)

In reply to a post by Jack_Hackett:

Low ping is a big help when gaming but as you say 3ms isn't going to make the slightest bit of difference even if some deluded gamers would have you believe it does.

.

I don't really game that much, I play a couple, but not online, I am not that good at most of them, so playing online would be useless as I would lose a lot.

Not sure what this lad at work does with his, I think it is only him and his partner.