In reply to a post by Chrysalis:

Whilst BT probably performs better than plusnet at busier times this isnt due to BTw throttling plusnet but rather plusnet's own internal policies.

Errrm?

Based on what please? Other than your own incorrect assessment of PlusNet's prioritisation system which is specifically designed to improve busy period performance compared to ISPs such as BT Retail which do not have it. Or - maybe BT does! PlusNet's traffic management expertise probably being why they bought it.

Something that has been bothering me. Why do you mention "on unbundled exchange" in your Subject please? It's irrelevant to both BT Retail and PlusNet.

For info really. I figured BT may be a bit more ruthless on unbundled exchanges due to less competition etc.

I stated it for info only in case it made a different to the speeds. Why has it been bothering you?

When you say unbundled exchanges you have the definition wrong I believe. Not having a go, but just like people to have the right information.

An unbundled exchange is by definition one where BT Wholesale based services are sold by BT Retail, PlusNet, Zen, IDNet, AA, Entanet and many others. In addition a provider like C&W, Sky, or TalkTalk also have their own hardware at the exchange.

Thus by definition there is MORE competition as more providers have kit installed in the exchange.

I suspect you were referring to exchanges where Sky and TalkTalk do not have their own network available, which would be a non unbundled exchange.

Differences in quality of experience with BT Wholesale services may be experienced between exchanges because of the presence of either their old 20CN network or the better 21CN WBC network.

The big difference as others have said between two BT Wholesale based services on the same exchange, is usually the amount of bandwidth the provider actually buys from BT Wholesale.

Because it was irrelevant, and it's amazing how many people have the wrong idea about what unbundling means . It was possible you were one of them.

Don't know much about FTTC but if one took a line rental and fibre broadband package with ISP's such as TT or Sky who have LLU kit (previously used for ADSL2+) in an exchange would that FTTC service be full LLU?

Good question. I don't think so, but it is possible. It doesn't really matter, as the issue with full LLU is the phone line if you want to migrate away and that still applies.

How the FTTC migration away is handled I forget for the moment.

Incidentally, the MSAN's still carry ADSL2+ as well as (often) the FTTC.

Full LLU (MPF) is where the copper from the exchange to the premises carries both voice and ADSLx from the same supplier's MSAN. With FTTC the voice and VDSL2 signals are split off at the FTTC cabinet, with the voice getting back to the exchange via the old copper and the FTTC being handed over to the ISP via a GEA link at possibly a different exchange. Hence my doubt.

Just to add to the good info that others have given you.

Just remember that BT Wholesale sell their Products to a number of ISPs.

As far as BT Wholesale is concerned, BT Retail is just another ISP (along with PN etc).

BT Wholesale are NOT allowed to give discriminatory bias in favour of any of its ISP Customers.

BT Retail has NO influence over the service given to other ISPs.

Minor change is the competitive market areas, where providers are allowed within reason to negotiate discounts, hence how PlusNet is able to be so competitive in some parts of the UK.

I would think there is one missing step from the following for 'Full LLU' FTTC providers, like TT & Sky.

In reply to a post by RobertoS:

With FTTC the voice and VDSL2 signals are split off at the FTTC cabinet, with the voice getting back to the exchange via the old copper and the FTTC being handed over to the ISP via a GEA link at possibly a different exchange.

... and the voice being handed over from the BT PTSN to the ISP via its DSLAM in same exchange.