In reply to a post by jpm:

Has there ever been a commitment to a PSTN line remaining powered indefinitely during power outages or to the availability of the line? As far as I know there's always been a MBORC clause which is going to be the likely cause of a prolonged loss of exchange power.

What are the anticipated applications where a site must stay connected in the event of local power outage and mobile network failure for all carriers but diverse fibre such as RO2 is cost prohibitive?

“Special” telemetry which needs a PSTN service (where the BT exchanges may or may not run for a non-specified period of time - certainly not uniform) but not special enough that a fibre (single or dual/diverse) is too cost prohibitive. I’m scratching my head…

In reply to a post by jpm:

I'm sure they'd be open to hearing your suggestions for how better to manage the migration.

They have already changed and then realised that the provider only supplied digital voice, i had no part in them changing providers, I did not even know they were doing it until they told me it was done. They have a small business, so they are worried if there is a power cut they will lose the phone and asked me if there is anything that can be done. I recommended a UPS as that seems to be the best way.

In reply to a post by zyborg47:

If you read the articles, you will see that this is to do with PSTN, Openreach are slowing people's broadband down because they have not changed to digital voice or an alternative, not because they have not gone to Fibre.

And large ISPs (e.g. Plusnet, and Sky) haven't yet issued replacement "digital voice" capable routers to home users on ADSL or FTTC. I know at least two Sky customers on FTTP whom have "digital voice" capable routers but the phone is plugged into the Openreach wall port (WLR3).

This is going to take ages.... they haven't actualy started moving people.... so any idea that OR will interrupt the internet and slow it down is way way way too early. That sort of thing will be needed to get the final 2%.

In reply to a post by jchamier:

And large ISPs (e.g. Plusnet, and Sky) haven't yet issued replacement "digital voice" capable routers to home users on ADSL or FTTC. I know at least two Sky customers on FTTP whom have "digital voice" capable routers but the phone is plugged into the Openreach wall port (WLR3).

This is going to take ages.... they haven't actualy started moving people.... so any idea that OR will interrupt the internet and slow it down is way way way too early. That sort of thing will be needed to get the final 2%.

I don't think plusnet have any plans to got to digital voice, certainly not on FTTP. I have no idea how they are going to do things with FTTC as they are still advertising the service with voice. My next door neighbour changed to sky broadband last year and they are on digital voice, not that Sky told them, they only found out when the phone did not work, phoned Sky and sky told them to plug the phone into their router
I had to redo a phone extension, so they could move the router where their B T one was.


Sadly, Openreach think they can do what they like.

In reply to a post by zyborg47:

I don't think plusnet have any plans to got to digital voice, certainly not on FTTP. I have no idea how they are going to do things with FTTC as they are still advertising the service with voice.

A family member with PN has just re-contracted and has the new Hub 2 router which includes a “BT jack” on the back. So they are getting ready to do “digital voice” but nothing yet mentioned of course. A friend whom re-contracted just before Christmas didn’t get a new router, still on the Hub 1 and no info at all.

Sadly, Openreach think they can do what they like.

Not quite true, Ofcom are watching them like a hawk. But Ofcom can’t make Openreach keep the PSTN on ancient hardware forever. Easy loss in court, which wouldn’t be good for a regulator.

In reply to a post by jchamier:

A family member with PN has just re-contracted and has the new Hub 2 router which includes a “BT jack” on the back. So they are getting ready to do “digital voice” but nothing yet mentioned of course. A friend whom re-contracted just before Christmas didn’t get a new router, still on the Hub 1 and no info at all.

The new plusnet hub is based on one of the BT ones, with different firmware, and a different colour case, I doubt very much if the hardware will be changed, which is why the phone jack is in there. If it is used depends on if the firmware supports it or will be updated to support it, we will wait and see. The Zyxel router Plusnet sent me a while back have connections for VoIP, but they are disabled as plusnet put their own firmware on it, which is a shame as it would have been nice to be able to plug in my phones, configure it and use that instead of the Linksys pap adaptor I have.

Not quite true, Ofcom are watching them like a hawk. But Ofcom can’t make Openreach keep the PSTN on ancient hardware forever. Easy loss in court, which wouldn’t be good for a regulator.

Mmm, I have said for years, Openreach should be split from BT, to be honest I think they should go back as it was before they were privatised. Too many fingers in the pie that gets far too much money out of it, just like our energy companies to be honest, and it hits us the consumer.

People think I am against getting rid of PSTN, I am not against getting rid of it, I understand that things need to modernise. My problem is the way it has been handled, no notice to the consumer and no battery back up for people who need it and having to use a huge router for people who don't have broadband,
But the worse thing is the lack of communication, if I was not on sites like this I would never have known. A lot of people I chat to have no idea that it is going to happen.

A better job was done when we changed to that awful Frreeview rubbish and they turned off analogue TV.

In reply to a post by zyborg47:

Mmm, I have said for years, Openreach should be split from BT, to be honest I think they should go back as it was before they were privatised. Too many fingers in the pie that gets far too much money out of it, just like our energy companies to be honest, and it hits us the consumer.

and quite a court case between BT Group and the regulator over what happened to the pension funds. The decision to "arms length" instead of "split" was discussed in most papers.

People think I am against getting rid of PSTN, I am not against getting rid of it, I understand that things need to modernise. My problem is the way it has been handled, no notice to the consumer and no battery back up for people who need it and having to use a huge router for people who don't have broadband,

The number of people without broadband is reducing fast, and "huge router" is unlikely, it has already been mentioned of 'match box' size devices.

But the worse thing is the lack of communication, if I was not on sites like this I would never have known. A lot of people I chat to have no idea that it is going to happen.

That is where Ofcom and Openreach have required the communications provider to do the work. You should be chasing Plusnet, Sky, TalkTalk over their lack of advertising.

On this I agree, Ofcom should be centrally advertising on TV, they could even do it on the BBC as "public service" communication from the Government.

Edited by jchamier (Sat 04-Feb-23 12:45:17)

Customers haven't received communication yet because there is no need for them to do anything right now. The PSTN switch-off isn't happening outside of trial areas for over two years - there is still time for a 24-month contract signed today for WLR3+FTTC to run its full course before the switch-off deadline gets to within six months. There's also no point doing a big campaign that could cause confusion when the natural impact of stop-sell and FTTP-priority is going to do the bulk of the heavy lifting required in this migration. 1:1 discussions can happen between customers and ISPs at contract renewal time over the next two years.

We're in a situation on here where people are hearing about this change from industry forums, getting a clear understanding of what the changes are (because it's been explained multiple times), and then acting as if somehow they don't know and complaining that they haven't been told.

In reply to a post by jpm:

Customers haven't received communication yet because there is no need for them to do anything right now.

Good point, there isn't anything end users can do is there.

There's also no point doing a big campaign that could cause confusion when the natural impact of stop-sell and FTTP-priority is going to do the bulk of the heavy lifting required in this migration.

Maybe this autumns PSTN / WLR stop sell will have more impact? I was expecting that to be communicated.

We're in a situation on here where people are hearing about this change from industry forums, getting a clear understanding of what the changes are (because it's been explained multiple times), and then acting as if somehow they don't know and complaining that they haven't been told.

Forums, like the internet, have all sorts

In reply to a post by jchamier:

Maybe this autumns PSTN / WLR stop sell will have more impact? I was expecting that to be communicated.

I'm not convinced it will, I'm fairly sure the majority of customers will phone up at the end of their existing contracts to get a new deal, be asked if they need a phone line, say "no I use my mobile" and that will be that.