What gets me though is PlusNet are claiming they have less problems with LLU.

Could quite possibly be true as they only have approx 20,000 customers on LLU out of a total 200,000. We would only be able to measure the actual amount if it were 50% on LLU and 50% on BTw.

They were, but I'm sure when I looked a while back Plusnet posted somewhere to say they say 10% faults on BT and 8% on LLU. Not that big a difference given the limited coverage of LLU for Tiscali and the greater control they have...

I got moved to LLU without any Plusnet notification in mid June.

Its worked fine for me and there have been no problems. I suffered terrible peak hour contention problems with ADSLMax and these problems have gone with LLU.

Most of the people on here complaining about LLU aren't actually on LLU...several aren't even on Plusnet!

In reply to:

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Re Bulldog - I think its only a matter of time before Pipex sneak in and implement traffic shaing (in line with what they've done with f2s and Nildram)

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Don't forget that Pipex,F2S & Nildram customers use the BT network which costs more, BD customers are on the C&W network which is not as costley. Any future traffic shaping would either mean routing us through the Pipex network or it would have to be implimented by C&W.

Anyone is free to post about their happy experience with LLU but very few do. Possible explanations:

a) there aren't many happy (PlusNet/Tiscali) LLU users
b) forums tend to attract people who are having problems

You should also differentiate between people who have PlusNet LLU problems (ie customers) and people who comment on PlusNet's LLU policy (anyone).

Simon

Hi

PlusNet changed me to LLU in June, it worked for about half and day then died, it took 11 days to get a connection back. PlusNet support was hopeless.

It's worth noting the following, negative and positive:

• If you are looking for higher upload speeds note that despite PlusNet saying LLU customers get up to 800kps upload, it actually seems capped at 640. On various occasions I have asked about this and have never received an answer from PlusNet.
• There is no BRAS profile like BT so a bad sync has no affect on your download speeds for days afterwards, so you always get what you sync at.
• There is no automatic adjustment like MAX and no training period.
• Because there is no automatic training, the line is set to a conservative level, and that's an SNR of 12db (BT by default is 6db). So if you connect now with a margin of less than 12db, then on LLU, you will find you sync slower.
• ADSL2+ is supported in most exchanges (if your own hardware also supports it), so this gives you some extra db over ADSL1 (depending on distance from the exchange) so this may still allow you to connect at the same speeds as BT Max on LLU as you have extra SNR to play with.
• ADSL2+ is capped at 8Mbits/sec for the majority of PlusNet customers, don

Perhaps we should make your last post a sticky as it contains some good stuff in there?

A title like "How does being on a Plus.net (Tiscali) LLU connection affect me?" would be a good eye catcher.

Edited by caesar_salad (Sun 22-Oct-06 10:48:20)

I am not on Plusnet or LLU, and thank goodness Elcipse will now give people a choice to opt out just like Plusnet, if Tiscali unbundles our Exchange I ill certainly opt out, not that it is going to happen here.

>> Because there is no automatic training, the line is set to a conservative level, and
>> that's an SNR of 12db (BT by default is 6db). So if you connect now with a margin
>> of less than 12db, then on LLU, you will find you sync slower.

I wasn't aware of this - can this LLU SNR be lowered ??

At the moment, on maxDSL my SNR is between 5 and 6 (sync'ing at 5932). I was thinking about moving to Sky's LLU when it became available to me ... but if the SNR can't be lowered on LLU I may not bother.