Avoiding a phone in a cupboard

Hi all,
Apologies, complete tech newb here so please be patient with the questions!

We recently migrated from BT (with a standard landline) to hyperoptic, which (because i didn't read the fine print) I didn't realise comes with VoIP. The hyperoptic box is shut in a cupboard in a utility room so the only way to have a functioning landline at the moment is to plug the old phone directly into the router and have it sat just outside the (not particularly accessible) cupboard.

Now...on the old BT system the phone was connected by a standard phone cable (RJ11 I think) to the phone jack in the wall by the front door. This jack port also has an ethernet connection point which wasn't hooked up to anything. In the cupboard the old FTTP box had a phone port and this was wired to a phone jack in the cupboard using something like an RJ11 but with a flatter fitting at one end. This, presumably, then distributed the phone signal throughout the house.

My question is, without using a ton of ugly wiring just running through two rooms and several doorways, is is there a way of running the new VoIP cable from the router to the phone jack/ethernet port in the hall.

Any thoughts and help much appreciated!

Yes - with caveats. What you are attempting to do is called “voice re-injection”. Catchy huh 🤣

Basically you are using the existing voice extension cabling (and outlets) and repurposing them slightly to use the router voice port in lieu of the ‘landline’ in the master socket. The most important thing to do is to fully isolate/remove the incoming external copper line from your master socket.

For some background reading, see the wiki on the A&A support site:
https://support.aa.net.uk/VoIP_How_to:_Voice_reinjec...

It's not totally clear from your post, but did you have FTTP with BT before, and your telephone service came from the Openreach ONT and was connected into a socket in the cupboard? If so, you can remove this cable from the ONT and plug it into the Hyperoptic telephone port instead and all your sockets will come alive again.

Is the Hyperoptic connection in the same cupboard as the Openreach ONT? Can you take photos and post them to make things clearer?

Edit: Here is an Openreach FTTP-only install that I found on Google. The telephone socket underneath the ONT is the outgoing line from the ONT serving the other telephone sockets in the house. If that's how yours looks then you can plug the Hyperoptic router into this socket.

Edited by jpm (Mon 03-Jan-22 21:27:32)

It’s not 100% clear but it does sounds like the OP was possibly using the old Fibre Voice Access (FVA) product from the Openreach ONT - as per your stock photo - and this was already being re-injected into the extension wiring.

However the “old FTTP box” may have also been a BT SmartHub and using BT Digital Voice. Not that should really matter to the end result, but what the OP had may not match up with your stock photo.

In any event it sounds hopefully like a plug and play solution - but I’d still urge caution for the OP and anyone else reading to make sure that there is no external copper PSTN line connected into the master socket / extension wiring before reinjecting voice into there.

hi all, many thanks for the insights, just took a load of pictures and annotated but there seems to be no obvious way to upload them in the reply...

In reply to a post by technewb:

hi all, many thanks for the insights, just took a load of pictures and annotated but there seems to be no obvious way to upload them in the reply...

You need to upload them to a 3rd party image hosting site or something like Google drive and then link them here.

Excellent, thanks!

pictures

Hopefully this works. I've included an annotated one, one of the original box where the phone line plugged in in the cupboard and one of the outlet where the phone originally plugged in. As you can see from the mess of wires the phone is currently plugged directly into the router.

Edited by technewb (Tue 04-Jan-22 11:08:23)

You could plug a DECT base station in and leave it in the cupboard. Put handsets wherever you want. No cables.

John

In reply to a post by technewb:

Hopefully this works.

You didn't put any text in the section after the URL, so it displays as blank. If you can edit the post, just add the word pictures after the ] and before the [/url section.

In reply to a post by technewb:

Excellent, thanks!

pictures

Hopefully this works. I've included an annotated one, one of the original box where the phone line plugged in in the cupboard and one of the outlet where the phone originally plugged in. As you can see from the mess of wires the phone is currently plugged directly into the router.

Photos make it clear. You previously had what is called Fibre Voice Access (FVA) which emanates from the voice port of the Openreach ONT inside the white enclosure. This would have been connected into the telephone extension wiring via the shuttered socket on the wall in the cupboard and connected to the similar shuttered phone socket outside.

You ought to be able to similarly connect the voice port from the Hyperoptic router into the same wall socket and similarly connect your analogue phone on the outside wall socket.

Excellent, that is good news! I am short some cables so I might need to purchase some extras so quick query on that front. At the moment, the phone is plugged into the router with an RJ11 which is RJ11 at both ends. Previously, the phone was plugged into the white ONT box with RJ11 at the shuttered end, but within the box at the other end of that cable was what I think is an RJ45 (flatter and wider than the RJ11 connection). Will this make any difference?

So what I plan to do at the moment is run an RJ11 from Phone1 to the shuttered port in the cupboard, then run an RJ11 from the shutter by the table to the phone, and you think this should work? (sorry for clarification, like to keep it all super simple so I don't end up with tons of cables I don't need!)

Those are euro modules outlets that snap into the faceplate. The module on the right side of the wall plate, where you said the phone was previously connected, looks to be a typical BT outlet. Ditto the outlet shown in the cupboard. It’s not an RJ11. It should accept a standard BT (431A) plug, usually white, with the retaining tang on the short side of the connector.

The equipment (handset and Hyper’s router) will typically have an RJ11 connector - the plug is transparent, with the retaining tang on the opposite side of the plug to the contacts (6 position with 4 contacts).

Check that is what you have (slide the shutter up on the outlet) but i reckon all you need is two RJ11 to BT (431A) adapter cables. Typically available on somewhere like Amazon or CPC-Farnell for a few quid each.

Edited by Pheasant (Tue 04-Jan-22 14:54:34)

You should have the cable you need already if you connected the ONT to the phone socket previously. Hyperoptic should have included an RJ11 to BT socket adapter with their router to present the phone socket as the correct type for the UK.

In reply to a post by jpm:

Hyperoptic should have included an RJ11 to BT socket adapter with their router to present the phone socket as the correct type for the UK.

Doesn’t look as though they do…include any voice cables.

https://www.hyperoptic.com/faq/posts/setting-up-your...

Previous Openreach FVA cable would have a BT plug rather than RJ11

I do hope you get the placement sorted out nicely but I wanted to thank you for giving me a chuckle... Your comment of "the old FTTP box..." made me smile. For many people, anything "FTTP" is from the future... way-in-the-future tech!

In reply to a post by DanielCoffey67:

I do hope you get the placement sorted out nicely but I wanted to thank you for giving me a chuckle... Your comment of "the old FTTP box..." made me smile. For many people, anything "FTTP" is from the future... way-in-the-future tech!

It's an enclosure that hasn't been used for a few years. It contained a battery that's no longer supplied for a product that no longer exists.

I think that qualifies as old (belonging to the past; former).

In reply to a post by j0hn83:

In reply to a post by DanielCoffey67:

I do hope you get the placement sorted out nicely but I wanted to thank you for giving me a chuckle... Your comment of "the old FTTP box..." made me smile. For many people, anything "FTTP" is from the future... way-in-the-future tech!

It's an enclosure that hasn't been used for a few years. It contained a battery that's no longer supplied for a product that no longer exists.

I think that qualifies as old (belonging to the past; former).

oh John, Daniel's post was funny until you added your post

And there was me thinking the way to avoid a phone in a cupboard was to close the cupboard door.

In reply to a post by j0hn83:

In reply to a post by DanielCoffey67:

I do hope you get the placement sorted out nicely but I wanted to thank you for giving me a chuckle... Your comment of "the old FTTP box..." made me smile. For many people, anything "FTTP" is from the future... way-in-the-future tech!

It's an enclosure that hasn't been used for a few years. It contained a battery that's no longer supplied for a product that no longer exists.

I think that qualifies as old (belonging to the past; former).

OP could re-use the backup battery just run the output lead from the BBU to the ‘new’ 😅 ZTE router which has 12V input, probably the same size barrel connector.

Hey presto some backup power for free and good use of all that ‘ancient’ tech from 2018 🤩

In reply to a post by pluralist:

And there was me thinking the way to avoid a phone in a cupboard was to close the cupboard door.

In reply to a post by pluralist:

And there was me thinking the way to avoid a phone in a cupboard was to close the cupboard door.

Bob wins the Larry Grayson award this week.

In reply to a post by GonePostal:

In reply to a post by pluralist:

And there was me thinking the way to avoid a phone in a cupboard was to close the cupboard door.

Bob wins the Larry Grayson award this week.

Like what you did there but I can already hear the cries from people in other parts of the forum asking for a recount

Edited by deleted (Wed 05-Jan-22 16:01:47)

Hi there! We do not include the adapter in our welcome pack, as the phone line is not mandatory with us and not everyone chooses broadband and phone, however, we do have adapters that we can send out if a customer requires it.

Just thought I'd update (in case anyone cared) bought an RJ11 to BT adapter at super cheap from t'internet and it works perfectly despite some bits of hyperoptic saying 'we don't work through BT lines so plugging yourself into your phone line won't work'.

Thanks for all the help guys, very much appreciated!

Thanks for circling back. Best wishes.