Down Down Down

I may have been a little premature with my previous post "Boring Boring Boring".

My line ceased to work two weeks ago and I have been without a fibre connection since then, No data/no phone.

After a week, (and with the involvement of BT Executive Customer Relations) I was send an unlimited data 4g hub that is OK,if not inconvenient, for the laptops/TVs in the house, but was no good for the desktops until I bought and fitted Wifi PCie cards to them.

So, has anyone else been affected by a 'Major Service Outage' in South London/Bromley ?

It's also made me conclude, that having survived running a 5 adult household on a 30Mb download speed capped, unlimited data SIM sitting in a tiny 4g hub, (albeit with some ping issues) , that maybe I'll ditch the land line/fibre at the end of the contract and get a 4g/5g router and buy an unlimited data SIM and save a lot of money !!!

Following Boring, Boring, Boring and Down, Down, Down - will there be a future Up, Up, Up thread? 🙈😅

[sorry don’t mean to revel in your broadband misfortune]

On a serious note, are BT paying you compensation for loss of service?

Up Up and away I think !

Yes, after 2 days of non service , compensation of £8.40 a day (not including the restoration day) kicks in so 11 days so far £92.40 , whoopee !. I had to buy 2 PCie cards for the desktops , circa £50, so I am still ahead !

No sign of when this will end, and given this is a "Major Service Outage" I am suprised there are no other complainants

Some tinge of a silver lining I guess 👍

Perhaps one of the members with visibility of the Openreach systems, will comment on what the major fault is / service restoration target.

Good luck.

So, still down , but spoke to an Openreach engineer this morning connecting up FTTH on the next pole , just round the corner from me, funnily enough it was the same guy I had. That pole had connectivity, and his next job was circa 40 houses down my same road.

So where is the problem ?, at my pole , or further up the network ? at the exchange ?

Does anyone know the network topography ? I will get another update Monday, that's 3 weeks down

What lights have you got on your ONT?

Alarm off

LAN green

PON Red

Power Green

Thanks

The 'Alarm' light is a new one on me, I was expects you to have a 'LOS' light but you didn't list it so maybe you don't have one, do you know what brand of ONT you have as it doesn't sound like a Huawei or a Nokia maybe its a new type ADTRAN

Edited by deleted (Wed 27-Jul-22 22:31:04)

It has no makers details on the external front/sides.

It has Openreach printed on the front in purple lower case letters

A serial number and barcode sticker

And "Moving ? please leave me behind"

Optical in in LAN out Power and an on off button

I can't find a matching picture on line.........

Is this actually Bromley exchange area or one of the adjacent areas?

So where is the problem ?, at my pole , or further up the network ? at the exchange ?

Don’t know if Openreach use such, but specialised “PON-aware” optical time domain reflectometers (OTDR) have been around for years - this tool effectively maps the PON and shows for example the splitter node and distances etc. If there’s a total discontinuity / break in the fibre ot will show that too - together with cable distances…one can do the same tests with a regular OTDR but it is slightly more manual.

I am/was on LSHAY exchange ,but I don't know where I am connected to now

The area is infested with Openreach vans and telephone poles and homes being connected, not that it helps me.

I asked around but couldn't find any MSO for that area.

It would be very weird for a big outage to last this long, is there any chance that it's a fault that is only affecting you but for some reason your ISP are waiting for an unrelated fault to clear before sending an engineer out?

In reply to a post by jpm:

It would be very weird for a big outage to last this long, is there any chance that it's a fault that is only affecting you but for some reason your ISP are waiting for an unrelated fault to clear before sending an engineer out?

Really need to know if any immediate neighbours of OP are also having issues (if they are on FTTP), those further down road or round the corner may be on a different PON.

Strike action today and Monday won't help - although they should prioritize service restoration over new provisions.

Being out of service for > 2 weeks is very poor show. Openreach *should* be informing your ISP of what's going on, and they in turn should be passing on that information. The only valid reason I can think of is a collapsed duct on a busy road, which requires special traffic management. Even then, there are procedures for dealing with emergency repairs.

I wonder if CEO high-level complaints is the next step.

In reply to a post by candlerb:

The only valid reason I can think of is a collapsed duct on a busy road, which requires special traffic management. Even then, there are procedures for dealing with emergency repairs.

That was the reason for asking if it was just the OP property or more wide spread, we don't even know if an Openreach engineer has actually been out to investigate the issue.

Now when I look up my account there is no Major Service Outage , and when I input my number on the status checker , no problems reported, but PON is still red.

I rang my contact at BT Executive Customer Relations (been in contact with them for two weeks) but they are on strike, so I texted help to the 61998 number , the BT diagnostics bot found a fault and I have booked an Openreach engineer for tommorrow.

So we'll see what happens now

I've just seen a message on my account that says I have lost my right to leave the contract early as BT have been unable to monitor my speeds, you couldn't make it up !!

I've just booked an Engineer for tommorrow, see my reply to candlerb

Given the strike today my fingers are firmly crossed

As I said to Candlerb

Now when I look up my account there is no Major Service Outage , and when I input my number on the status checker , no problems reported, but PON is still red.

I rang my contact at BT Executive Customer Relations (been in contact with them for two weeks) but they are on strike, so I texted help to the 61998 number , the BT diagnostics bot found a fault and I have booked an Openreach engineer for tommorrow.

So we'll see what happens now

I've just seen a message on my account that says I have lost my right to leave the contract early as BT have been unable to monitor my speeds, you couldn't make it up !!

In reply to a post by TheBaron:

I've just booked an Engineer for tomorrow

So they haven't been out over the last couple of weeks?

No, they (BT) kept telling me it was an MSO and they were awaiting an update from Openreach, and in fact were only due one tommorrow when they had scheduled to call me back for an update.

Seeing that the fault was 'cleared' on the status checker but I'm still not working, I've preempted that call by getting a line test/engineer visit by texting 61998 and reporting it again.

On my account is a closed fault for an upfront test 3rd July a week after the instal, and No Connection the day after it went down, now I have an open fault for a slow connection !! raised today.......

I don't believe its a MSO or even a fibre cabling issue between the exchange and you, if I was a gambler I would go for configuration (not at your end).

Thanks, it was working for 17 days so someone changed the configuration ?

Would that be BT (ISP) or Openreach ?

Would it be resolved tommorrow , or I guess that depends on the outcome ?

Interesting that they are working Saturday - with a strike on Friday and Monday. Anything to do with premium pay for weekends, I wonder?

Its just my opinion based on the 'Alarm' light being the same as the 'LOS' light on other models of ONT. if the light is not on then there is light on the fibre.

If someone turns up tomorrow they will be able to determine light levels from the exchange but will most likely need someone else's involvement to sort the issue.

Alternatively my opinion may be way off

Edited by deleted (Fri 29-Jul-22 16:26:22)

Poor quality splice work in the CSP has been known in some cases to fail quite early on - some days after the initial connection has been made.

[the ‘major service outage’ sounds like a bit of creative licence BS frankly!]

In reply to a post by TheBaron:

Thanks, it was working for 17 days so someone changed the configuration ?

Would that be BT (ISP) or Openreach ?

Would it be resolved tommorrow , or I guess that depends on the outcome ?

If i was a betting man, i would say this could well be nothing more than a failed splice in the csp on the front of your property and absolutely nothing else.

Config changes? No way. How would a "config change" bring on the alarm light that is indicating there is no light coming into the ONT from outside? It wouldn't. There is a broken cable/splice nothing more.

I would also suspect this outage has also been prolonged as BT haven't raised this with Openreach at all for whatever reason. See what the engineer finds tomorrow.

In reply to a post by TheInstaller:

Config changes? No way. How would a "config change" bring on the alarm light that is indicating there is no light coming into the ONT from outside? It wouldn't. There is a broken cable/splice nothing more.

The 'Alarm' light isn't on thats my point, but as I've said before this ONT doesn't appear to be either a Nokia or Huawei so understanding the lights compared to those models is a guessing game.

I agree with Dect - PON Light from my limited experience terms an invalid / unable to establish a connection with the OLT. The Alarm Light sounds like a version of a LOS light, which suggests light is getting through, just potentially not enough!

In reply to a post by Whitehall11:

I agree with Dect - PON Light from my limited experience terms an invalid / unable to establish a connection with the OLT. The Alarm Light sounds like a version of a LOS light, which suggests light is getting through, just potentially not enough!

Be good to see an actual photo of the ONT from the OP.

I suspect this isn’t either an ECI, Huawei or Nokia ONT!

Neither of these actually sport an “alarm”‘symbol LED - they have a separate PON and separate LOS labelled LEDs, which are very straightforward to distinguish if there is a no / insufficient light at to the unit (LOS is solid red) or a PON authentication/ misconfiguration issue (light is off or blinking rather than solid green).

If the OPs device has an “alarm” LED I suspect they may have an (hitherto very untypical for Openreach) an Adtran ONT.

The “alarm” symbol LED on an Adtran ONT actually doesn’t imply there is an optical issue (lack or no light) or a PON authentication issue. Rather it has to do with the ONT software operational state. Therefore even if there is no light this LED would be switched off.

In reply to a post by Pheasant:

The “alarm” symbol LED on an Adtran ONT actually doesn’t imply there is an optical issue (lack or no light) or a PON authentication issue. Rather it has to do with the ONT software operational state. Therefore even if there is no light this LED would be switched off.

This is good info that I wasn't aware of before stating my opinion about it being a configuration issue. In this case maybe the PON light being Red on this model is more significant due to there being no 'LOS' light on this model.

In reply to a post by TheBaron:

A serial number and barcode sticker
...
I can't find a matching picture on line.........

What are the first four characters of the serial number? You can ID the make of the ONT from the first fours chars.

S/N starts ADTN214 *****

That suggests an Adtran ONT ?, but its not the 401 or 411 I can find details of.

But I found it with image search

https://www.google.com/imgres?imgurl=https://helpfor...

https://www.google.com/imgres?imgurl=https://helpfor...

Yep it’s an Openreach version of an Adtran SDX 611 in white casing. They are ordinarily black in colour.

LED details here:

https://www.manualslib.com/manual/2238784/Adtran-Sdx...

Adtran SDX611 datasheet.

Here are some screenshots from the SDX 611Quick Start Guide, page 1, page 2, page 3 and page 4

You will see status lights sequence explained on page 3

I think we posted at the almost the same time 😂

The only difference to be aware of is the LED naming in the SDX Quick Start Guide is based on the standard Adtran symbols used. Its fairly obvious though...but "PON" on the Openreach version is the equivalent of "Optical" on the standard box

In reply to a post by TheBaron:

https://www.google.com/imgres?imgurl=https://helpfor...

Yes the standard black coloured SDX 611 is also used by HeyBroadband on their network.

See post with image from this hallowed forum 😃

[Note the LED sequence in "normal" operation - although there is no LAN cable plugged in, if there was that LED would be green too.]

Thanks Pheasant/Andy.

Just waiting on the engineer now.....

22 Jul 2022

at 08:33
Reported Fault
Problem

Broadband - Slow Connection
Reference number

VOL055-xxxxxxxxxxxxx
22 Jul 2022
Other products affected

You may also experience problems with other services such as your Digital Voice whilst we fix your fault.


29 Jul 2022

at 12:31
Engineer appointment booked
Problem

Broadband - Slow Connection
Reference number

VOL055-xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Estimated arrival

Sat 30 Jul 2022

between 08:00 - 13:00

29 Jul 2022

at 12:31
Right to exit removed

We’ve had to remove your right to exit your contract without penalty, as we’ve not been able to monitor your speed or get any required information from you.

Contact us

Today

30 Jul 2022
Engineer visit
Engineer name

Engineer mobile

Estimated arrival

today between 08:00 - 13:00

3 Aug 2022
Estimated fix date


No named engineer or number, hmmm

For completeness on ONT serial number ID, the first characters form the Vendor ID:

- Huawei ONT's have 16 digit (hex) serial numbers, the opening characters are always 48575443 which is hexadecimal for "HWTC"

- Nokia ONTs have 12 digit (ascii) serial numbers , the opening characters are always ALCL (all Nokia GPON products use the manufactures ID of their Alcatel-Lucent parentage)

- Adtran ONTs as we can see follow the same pattern as Nokia/Alcatel and use 12 digit (ascii) serial numbers

the Vendor ID is used in the authentication process onto the PON by the OLT

Good luck.

As noted above, if any of your immediate neighbours on the same CBT (or possibly nearby CBTs) are fine - then with your ONT light status it suggests insufficient/no light - so culprit #1 would be a bodgy splice in the CSP. A few light tests by the engineer on the street and indoors would easily confirm.

29 Jul 2022

at 12:31
Right to exit removed

We’ve had to remove your right to exit your contract without penalty, as we’ve not been able to monitor your speed or get any required information from you.

Contact us


Today - Sat 30 Jul 2022

30 Jul 2022
Engineer Visit Complete

3 Aug 2022
Estimated fix date

NO [censored] engineer has been and the fault is still there !

This is tragi-comic..........

Needs escalation, but with strike on Monday, I’m not hopeful you’ll see anything before Tuesday/Wednesday at best. Fingers crossed for you🤞

In reply to a post by TheBaron:

Today - Sat 30 Jul 2022

30 Jul 2022
Engineer Visit Complete

3 Aug 2022
Estimated fix date

Reading that, has the engineer found a fault outwith your property that (s)he was unable to fix at the time and which should now be fixed on/by 3rd. August?

Maybe , the estimated fix date was there before the Engineer Visit Complete update though

Well, would you belive it, just had a call from a real live Openreach engineer who'll be here at about 1145, asked me what the problem was, which I said was a red light on the Adtran ONT and he said he'd get a spare to bring along just in case, so progress of sorts.....

OK , all done, it was a break (2 actually) in the fibre within the CSP, he stripped it back ? , repaired it and all good now

There was no Major Service Outage after all [censored]

In reply to a post by TheBaron:

OK , all done, it was a break (2 actually) in the fibre within the CSP, he stripped it back ? , repaired it and all good now

This definitely seems to be the main cause of early stage FTTP failures.

When you think about it, so little of the installer's job is actually splicing - they'd probably be lucky to do 10 splices in a day. Compared to someone whose job is doing 48-way trays or 288f spines all day, they don't have much chance to get good at it.

I am tempted to bring a splicer home from work and re-do my CSP. From what the installer told me there is 4dB of loss between the CBT and ONT... but on the other hand it works fine, and I'm inclined to say he was just making stuff up to talk about.

Edited by ft247 (Sat 30-Jul-22 14:31:52)

There should always be plenty of spare in the CSP to re-splice several times over and then some. However two breaks suggest someone may have been a bit heavy handed or very very unfortunate 🤣

4dB!!! What. I call BS.

In reply to a post by TheBaron:

it was a break (2 actually) in the fibre within the CSP, he stripped it back ? , repaired it and all good now

One thing having a bad splice but 2 breaks in the fibre, is that back luck or poor workmanship?

Possibly over enthusiasm with the stripper (easy there guv 🤣), nicked the fibre slightly and caused it to eventually crack and fail.