FTTP 1000/220 Exchanges

I know it�s a bit of a mute point as there are seemingly no nationwide isps selling the 1000/220 FTTP Product. Just curious as a some exchanges list the 1000 option where FTTP is available but there are also several that still have the 330/50 option as the top product. Will most FTTP exchanges eventually be enabled for the 1000 product or is this only likely to happen at larger / higher demand exchanges ?

Thanks

I would like to know this answer too.

Well I spoke to BT about this on the phone when it showed up on the wholesale checker, back in June - July this year.

BT response to the Ultrafast 3 [500Mbps (down), 165Mbps (up)] and Ultrafast 4 [1Gbps (down), 220Mbps (up)] speeds was that nothing was scheduled as yet but was surprised how I know about it LOL

They did say once "they" become available it will be listed on their site.

Sadly their site is all messed up for me at the moment to a point where it even says I cannot even get Ultrafast but can get "Superfast Fibre 4 Plus" yet I already have "Ultrafast 2 Plus" LOL

The last time things like this happened was when they were preparing site for new products, "not saying this will be the case this time"

TBH I am not really interested with the 500Mbps down or even the 1Gbps down, sure they would be great to have, but as a content creator and hardware / software developer, I am more interested in the up speeds, for us here 330(approx 306 to 312Mbps) is already fine for us.

But I assume the price difference will be a fair bit more, but time till tell.

Paul

As things stand it�s FTTP lines with Huawei GPON hardware which show up as 1000/220 on the BT checker, the ECI based lines still show 330/50. Whether the ECI kit can be upgraded easily to support higher speeds I�ve no idea....

Sounds like you got a Muppet on the phone who likes to make things up.
There's nobody public facing that would be able to answer such questions.

The likelihood of BT Retail offering the higher tiers in the next couple years is zilch, nil, zero.
It's XG-PON, needs a new ONT, and comes with a hefty £500 + VAT install fee.

Just because OpenReach sell a product doesn't mean BT ever will.

In reply to a post by j0hn83:

Sounds like you got a Muppet on the phone who likes to make things up.
There's nobody public facing that would be able to answer such questions.

The likelihood of BT Retail offering the higher tiers in the next couple years is zilch, nil, zero.
It's XG-PON, needs a new ONT, and comes with a hefty £500 + VAT install fee.

Just because OpenReach sell a product doesn't mean BT ever will.

Oh I totally agree with you.
This is probably why I see the following:

ONT exists with active service. A spare port is available. A new ONT may be ordered.

But I might be wrong, but that new ONT part popped up exactly when it said those new speeds were available.

Paul

A new ONT may be ordered.

Nah it's a generic message.
Also appears for FTTP connections where XG-PON higher speed packages aren't available.

In reply to a post by j0hn83:

A new ONT may be ordered.

Nah it's a generic message.
Also appears for FTTP connections where XG-PON higher speed packages aren't available.

Ah ok, wasn't too sure that's all.

Paul

Lot of misinformation in this thread, hope the below clarifies.

The 500Mb & 1Gb FTTP products are available nationally on any FTTP provided on a Huawei head-end (As it can have 10Gb GEA cablelinks, whereas ECI cannot).

When you look at the BT Wholesale checker it will show you what BT Wholesale ISPs can provide via their network.
If you see only 330/50 then it is because either the FTTP is ECI backed, or more likely that Wholesale do not have a 10Gb GEA cablelinks in place to the L2S, or sufficient back-haul capacity to provide the service.


There are in fact ISPs (us included) that do and have been selling the 500Mb & 1Gb products for some time, limited to geography.
(If anyone is in the West/East Midlands and keen to consume this product, get in touch).

These are premium products so you shouldn't expect these to fall into the regular residential pricing tiers.
Indeed the £500 install from Openreach is used as a "reserve" put aside for the cost of the XG-PON upgrade when capacity on the existing PON exceeded. There is no (non-trial) installation of XG-PON in the network today.

Hope that clarifies.

In reply to a post by Blmcg:

The 500Mb & 1Gb FTTP products are available nationally on any FTTP provided on a Huawei head-end (As it can have 10Gb GEA cablelinks, whereas ECI cannot).

There are in fact ISPs (us included) that do and have been selling the 500Mb & 1Gb products for some time, limited to geography.
(If anyone is in the West/East Midlands and keen to consume this product, get in touch).

Apologies if I've misunderstood you but you appear to be contradicting yourself with the above? Surely if the BT/Openreach checker shows availability for 0.5 & 1 Gig FTTP services for a particular property then your ISP should be able to supply such a property irrespective of geographic location? Its the same with my ISP (FluidOne), they said they sell BTW/Openreach based 1 Gig FTTP services but said its not available for my property in the Highlands despite the Openreach checker saying otherwise:
https://i.postimg.cc/q7X3H2LQ/bt-checker.jpg

You're looking at the BTWholesale checker, not the Openreach checker.
There's not really a public interface for the Openreach part, just top level yes/no availability on the "where and when" pages.
Hope that makes more sense!

So are you saying Openreach and BT Wholesale have different opinions on where the 500 and 1000 Mbps FTTP services are available?

I don�t know the answer to your question Andrew but why would that surprise you if that were the case?

In reply to a post by MrSaffron:

So are you saying Openreach and BT Wholesale have different opinions on where the 500 and 1000 Mbps FTTP services are available?

Essentially yes. The 500 and 1Gb products become available nationwide on launch, with the only exception being the limited ECI OLTs.
If you see a 330 limit on the wholesale checker it's because either it's ECI, or it's a wholesale introduced restriction.
Openreach don't even list a speed for FTTP, availablity is implied.

In reply to a post by Blmcg:

Openreach don't even list a speed for FTTP, availablity is implied.

I�m not sure what you mean by that. All the FTTP speeds are listed in this Openreach price list. Scroll down to the second table for the higher than 330Mbps prices.

He's talking about the OpenReach availability checker.

It does not list what speeds are available to an individual property.

Have seen a mixture of 330 and 1000 Mbps even on the same exchange, so the nuances are very granular beyond exchange level

But we all know that . That�s why I couldn�t understand what he meant. Only the BTW checker has ever worked for properties. Or the ISP checkers that basically access its database.

In reply to a post by RobertoS:

But we all know that . That�s why I couldn�t understand what he meant. Only the BTW checker has ever worked for properties. Or the ISP checkers that basically access its database.

I think Blmcg is referring to another Openreach checker - not accessible to Jo Public (CP only) - which gives another check on FTTP availability. If true, I'm confused as to why BT Wholesale and Openreach aren't singing off the same hymn sheet wrt FTTP speeds/availability, ie why would the BTW checker show 1 Gig FTTP available for a property but the Openreach CP only checker doesn't? Doesn't quite add up...

Edited by deleted (Sun 30-Dec-18 18:47:18)

In reply to a post by MrSaffron:

Have seen a mixture of 330 and 1000 Mbps even on the same exchange, so the nuances are very granular beyond exchange level

Same applies in my area. BTW checker shows max available FTTP speed as 1 Gig on my line, yet not far away on a fibre only new build site (IV2 6ET), the checker shows 330 Mbps as max - despite the terminating exchange being the same in both cases (Inverness Macdhui).

Edited by deleted (Sun 30-Dec-18 11:11:51)

What about the difference between 330/30 and 330/50? Is this also due to the type of equipment at the exchange?

I am in the process of having FTTPoD installed, and I believe I will get 330/30 - this is what the checker says is available. However the wholesale price list shows both 330/30 and 330/50 at the same price.

So I presume it must be a technology limit which means that some properties can only take 330/30 rather than 330/50 ?

I believe BT Wholesale don't sell anything above 330/30 on FTTPoD, despite higher speeds available on FTTPoD on Openreach's pricelist. Even if BTW did sell the higher speeds on FTTPoD, the CPs would still have to make them available to the public.

AFAIK the 330/30 & 330/50 tiers run on both ECI and Huawei headend equipment so nothing to do with hardware limitations. However on native FTTP lines, the CP will usually provision 330/50 instead of 330/30 as both are sold at the same price by BT Wholesale & Openreach. Why BT Wholesale can't supply 330/50 instead of 330/30 on FTTPoD lines, only God knows....

Edited by deleted (Sun 30-Dec-18 12:31:57)

In reply to a post by j0hn83:

He's talking about the OpenReach availability checker.

It does not list what speeds are available to an individual property.

Well in a way they do, they just don't display it, FTTC speeds seems to be in the range of the BTW listed speed, however FTTP just show the 330Mbps down and don't list the up.

A few of us have created apps that display all that information available, we did this to save us going the other way to get it, I know BT (chairman's office) are aware of mine along with my BTW Checker I wrote a while back, which was made known to them by my local MP when we were trying to get FTTP a few years back.

I was told to stop using my BTW App back then which I did.

I still use my other app on the "Where and When Page" every few weeks to see if new information has been added and from time to time some stuff gets added, like G.Fast speeds (which are empty due to we don't have G.Fast in my area, or it might just not be used as yet), so I am always updating my app etc.

Paul

In reply to a post by baby_frogmella:

I think Blmcg is referring to another Openreach checker - not accessible to Jo Public (CP only) - which gives another check on FTTP availability.

Correct

In reply to a post by baby_frogmella:

If true, I'm confused as to why BT Wholesale and Openreach aren't singing off the same hymn sheet wrt FTTP speeds/availability, ie why would the BTW checker show 1 Gig FTTP available for a property but the Openreach CP only checker doesn't? Doesn't quite add up...

Because 500 & 1Gb products are available everywhere to a CP ready to consume them (bar ECI). Openreach don't even provide a speed estimate, availability is implied.

Doesn't mean BTW is geared up for it yet (10Gb GEA Cablelinks/10Gb Port capacity, Sufficient exchange backhaul etc).
They choose what speed to show and provide to us, where we use them.

In reply to a post by baby_frogmella:

I believe BT Wholesale don't sell anything above 330/30 on FTTPoD, despite higher speeds available on FTTPoD on Openreach's pricelist. Even if BTW did sell the higher speeds on FTTPoD, the CPs would still have to make them available to the public.

Why BT Wholesale can't supply 330/50 instead of 330/30 on FTTPoD lines, only God knows....

Wholesale can provide us 500 & 1Gb On Demand now.
160/30 330/50 on demand available from OR, but Wholesale won't provide these.
We can provide these in some parts of the country.

In reply to a post by Blmcg:

Lot of misinformation in this thread, hope the below clarifies.

If you see only 330/50 then it is because either the FTTP is ECI backed, or more likely that Wholesale do not have a 10Gb GEA cablelinks in place to the L2S, or sufficient back-haul capacity to provide the service.

Thanks. We've actually just noticed that, in the new build we're moving to next year, if we're lucky we'll have 330/50 maximum due to ECI OLT. If we're unlucky we'll have nothing as the network is at capacity so needs some work to connect the last properties. Hopefully they'll be scaling it and adding as they provision new units!

In reply to a post by Blmcg:

In reply to a post by baby_frogmella:

I think Blmcg is referring to another Openreach checker - not accessible to Jo Public (CP only) - which gives another check on FTTP availability.

Correct

In reply to a post by baby_frogmella:

If true, I'm confused as to why BT Wholesale and Openreach aren't singing off the same hymn sheet wrt FTTP speeds/availability, ie why would the BTW checker show 1 Gig FTTP available for a property but the Openreach CP only checker doesn't? Doesn't quite add up...

Because 500 & 1Gb products are available everywhere to a CP ready to consume them (bar ECI). Openreach don't even provide a speed estimate, availability is implied.

Doesn't mean BTW is geared up for it yet (10Gb GEA Cablelinks/10Gb Port capacity, Sufficient exchange backhaul etc).
They choose what speed to show and provide to us, where we use them.

Ok cheers. So based on what you said Wholesale are incorrectly showing 1 Gig FTTP availability for every most Huawei FTTP lines up & down the country. Have CPs such as yourself asked Wholesale to correct their Jo Public accessible checker? ie make their checker align with the CP only Openreach checker?

Edited by deleted (Mon 31-Dec-18 13:04:31)

In reply to a post by baby_frogmella:

I believe BT Wholesale don't sell anything above 330/30 on FTTPoD, despite higher speeds available on FTTPoD on Openreach's pricelist. Even if BTW did sell the higher speeds on FTTPoD, the CPs would still have to make them available to the public.

AFAIK the 330/30 & 330/50 tiers run on both ECI and Huawei headend equipment so nothing to do with hardware limitations. However on native FTTP lines, the CP will usually provision 330/50 instead of 330/30 as both are sold at the same price by BT Wholesale & Openreach. Why BT Wholesale can't supply 330/50 instead of 330/30 on FTTPoD lines, only God knows....

Thanks. So after 12 months I should have the option to regrade to 330/50. Or if I'm happy with the 30M upload speed, I might save a few quid by going to 160/30.

In reply to a post by Blmcg:

Wholesale can provide us 500 & 1Gb On Demand now.
160/30 330/50 on demand available from OR, but Wholesale won't provide these.
We can provide these in some parts of the country.

Out of interest, what parts of the country? It's always good to have a few alternatives.

Currently the only FTTPoD providers I know of are Cerberus (national), FluidOne (national), and Spectrum (Wales and South West)

Think he's saying that nothing is incorrect. Wholesale don't show gigabit availability for every line - there are lines on Huawei kit on Hunslet showing both depending on the backhaul Wholesale have in place from that OLT. Multiple OLTs serve the exchange as it's a parent, Wholesale don't have 10G backhaul to all of them.

Openreach, correctly, indicate all Huawei kit has gigabit available because it does. Whether their customers want to sell us gigabit on it is different and their largest customer's checker varies accordingly.

In reply to a post by Ignitionnet:

Think he's saying that nothing is incorrect. Wholesale don't show gigabit availability for every line - there are lines on Huawei kit on Hunslet showing both depending on the backhaul Wholesale have in place from that OLT. Multiple OLTs serve the exchange as it's a parent, Wholesale don't have 10G backhaul to all of them.

Openreach, correctly, indicate all Huawei kit has gigabit available because it does. Whether their customers want to sell us gigabit on it is different and their largest customer's checker varies accordingly.

But then why would the Wholesale checker show 1 Gig as 'available' for my line yet no ISP is able to sell me with such a service (despite ISPs offering this)? I would have thought the Wholesale checker would only show 'available' once all the pre-requisites for the Gigabit service had been met, eg Huawei GPON hardware, 10Gbps cable links in place, enough backhaul etc. But clearly they haven't for my line (and others too I imagine) so I'm puzzled as to why the Wholesale and Openreach (CP only) checkers churn out different results.

Edited by deleted (Mon 31-Dec-18 12:35:55)

In reply to a post by baby_frogmella:

But then why would the Wholesale checker show 1 Gig as 'available' for my line yet no ISP is able to sell me with such a service (despite ISPs offering this)? I would have thought the Wholesale checker would only show 'available' once all the pre-requisites for the Gigabit service had been met, eg Huawei GPON hardware, 10Gbps cable links in place, enough backhaul etc. But clearly they haven't for my line (and others too I imagine) so I'm puzzled as to why the Wholesale and Openreach (CP only) checkers churn out different results.

As far as ISPs go same reason A&A don't sell 330Mb, or others 500Mb. You probably use at peak times perhaps 3-10Mb/s, I'll go high as you're on FoD, having another 900+Mb/s there for burst is a lot of capacity.

The checkers churn out different results because they are presenting different things. What ISPs sell is at their discretion from that point on - many just won't sell a gigabit because it's not compelling commercially - seen how much ISPs pay Wholesale per Mb/s per month?

Rather than thinking of it as checkers presenting the same data in different ways it's 3 different checkers. Each can offer at most what the previous one in the chain is advertising but from there it's CP or ISP discretion. Openreach indicate what's available between CableLink and customer, Wholesale what's available between CableLink and the edge of their network facing their customers, ISPs what's available between Wholesale's network and their Internet-facing edge. Many ISPs don't sell FTTP full stop even though they could. Wholesale don't have the required capacity in some areas to sell 500Mb or 1G.

Check out https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C9J6pEAU50M from the awesome Andy Furnell for some idea of the huge amounts of capacity required to allow FTTP customers on 300Mb to burst.

But a few ISPs such as FluidOne & Syscomm ARE selling 1 Gig nationwide on BTW/Openreach circuits at present, just as long as the Openreach CP only checker gives the green light:

http://forums.thinkbroadband.com/fibre/t/4609798-re-...

So, I'm really curious to know why the BT Wholesale checker will say 1 Gig FTTP is available for a particular property (eg mine) but the Openreach CP only checker says it isn't - FluidOne have confirmed that 1 Gig is NOT available on my line. Yet a property in (say in W Midlands) will also show up as 1 Gig ready in the BTW checker but then the Openreach CP only checker will say that property in W Midlands can indeed order the 1 Gig service. Or simply put, why isn't the BTW (public) checker in tune with the Openreach (CP only) checker? Hence why I suggested to Blmcg that perhaps BTW need this pointing out to them.

Edited by deleted (Mon 31-Dec-18 15:00:56)

Solve that puzzle and you may be able to solve why Ofcom say 1000 Mbps symmetric for some Openreach FTTP locations (no other FTTP provider that I know about either)

Seems to me like the FTTP market is still quite immature and there isn�t a coherent strategy in place even now regarding rollout. The discussion about speeds in excess of 330 seems pretty theoretical - who needs faster than this, really?

I live on a new-build estate on the edge of Derby on FTTP 200/20 and get 200+/21 with 7-9ms latency on speed tests, but we never even touch the sides with that capacity. We are clearly on Huawei headend as BTW checker lists our line as 1000/220. In fact, I think the headend was installed at the exchange for our estate, as from speaking to Openreach site engineers, our fibre doesn�t come from our local exchange as there is no headend there, (although the BTW checker indicates 330/50 FTTPoD available for properties connected to that exchange). We are connected to an exchange almost in the city centre, to which Openreach pulled 8km of 36-core fibre! What is even more weird is that on our estate of around 600 properties, only about a third of us have access to FTTP. The first phase of the estate is copper lines with no FTTC, then we are FTTP, and now they have gone back to copper as apparently they have run out of capacity. With a 32-way split, they should be able to serve 1,152 properties from 36 fibres though, which I don�t understand. The FTTP uptake on the estate is poor though, as we all have access to Virgin Media too and most people have gone with them due to price. Makes our contention ratio pretty favourable though

In reply to a post by germanbear:

With a 32-way split, they should be able to serve 1,152 properties from 36 fibres though, which I don�t understand.

To cover 1,152 properties they would need to install 9+ Splitter Nodes due to each Splitter Node only takes in up to 4 fibres that then gets split 32 ways providing a maximum of 128 fibres to be daisy chained to all the DP's or connectorized blocks.

All costs money.

Just wondering, how many was able to get FTTP?

Paul

First post, but followed adslguide/thinkbroadband for many years.

I recently moved to a new build with �native� fttp. Currently have virgin; seeing out balance of fixed term contact. The wholesale checker indicates max of 1000/220 for my address. Per this thread, there are no �mainstream� providers offering more than 330/50. If one was to approach a FluidOne / Cerberus or another �niche� provider, what is the likely cost of the 1000/220 service. I�m not expecting formal quote - more indicative cost. I also appreciate there is a 500gbp �connection� fee.

Happy new year to everyone.

OpenReach charge for 1000/220Mb is £960 + VAT per year.
£500 + VAT install fee.

https://www.openreach.co.uk/orpg/home/products/prici...

That's the price to the ISP. Then you have their charges and profit on top.

As has already been mentioned most selling this will be selling it as a business product.
No idea if the likes of Spectrum sell this as a residential offering on their patch.

Edited by j0hn83 (Mon 31-Dec-18 17:34:38)

In reply to a post by Agb_ldn:

If one was to approach a FluidOne / Cerberus or another �niche� provider, what is the likely cost of the 1000/220 service.

Not cheap! I think the monthly costs will be at least £200 p/m, probably a lot more + one off install costs of £500+. FluidOne do sell the 1 Gig service but weren't able to quote me as they said Openreach aren't able to supply me with the 1 Gig service, despite the BT Wholesale checker saying otherwise. If you live in the Midlands area then you may hit the jackpot as the 1 Gig Openreach service is only available in certain areas of the UK - irrespective of what the BT Checker shows for your fttp line. You're better off getting in touch with FluidOne and also Syscomm (see Blmcg's posts) for a custom quote. Not sure about Cerberus as they told me they don't sell anything more than 330/50 a couple of months ago - not sure if that's still the case.

Edited by deleted (Mon 31-Dec-18 17:46:51)

Pass. Syscomm say they don't sell it nationwide, limited by geography. Not actually aware of any operator that advertises the product for nationwide availability. Depending on how they buy capacity from BT Wholesale even if they did want to sell it it may require augmenting capacity specifically to sell to that one customer.

Last time i checked, BT Wholesale tails are available nationwide, not just in certain regions. Syscomm and Fluidone, unlike Spectrum Internet for example, don't have their own LLU network so can offer their services nationwide subject to carrier availability (usually BT Wholesale).

However in the case of the gigabit services, its clearly Openreach who are dictating to the ISPs where they can sell their services, ie it appears just selected exchanges are enabled for Gigabit BTW based services.

So assuming not every FTTP live exchange is equipped for Gigabit FTTP, this begs the question (again) why on earth is the BT Wholesale checker showing Gigabit availability for many FTTP lines despite actual availability limited to just a very very small proportion of those lines? This clearly indicates the public and CP only availability checkers not being in sync with one another. I suspect BT/Openreach won't be too bothered about fixing this 'anomaly' since

a) nationwide FTTP availability is relatively small
b) Those seriously contemplating Gigabit FTTP will be an even smaller number since its a very niche product.

The main reason I am (or was!) interested in a Gigabit service from FluidOne was primarily to get signficantly better upload speeds, 30 Mbps isn't that fast when you have to upload a few TBs of data at once so 220 Mbps upload would have been useful. Oh well I guess Openreach have to protect their leased line revenue so can't imagine them offering symmetrical speeds on FTTP anytime soon (if ever)

Edited by deleted (Tue 01-Jan-19 12:34:02)

I wonder what happens when someone gets a FTTP service installed using the Gigabit voucher scheme. My understand is to qualify the service needs to be capable of achieving download speeds of 1 Gb without the need for additional equipment later.

Edited by deleted (Tue 01-Jan-19 12:47:42)

In reply to a post by dect:

I wonder what happens when someone gets a FTTP service installed using the Gigabit voucher scheme. My understand is to qualify the service needs to be capable of achieving download speeds of 1 Gb without the need for additional equipment later.

Mmmmm I think you're right...reading the T&C's of the GBVS:

In reference to gigabitvoucher.culture.gov.uk/wp-content/uploads/2018/11/GBVS-Benef...:

4. Connectivity Requirements
All connections supported by vouchers must fulfil BOTH of the following characteristics:
1. be capable of delivering broadband connectivity to your premises at or above 1Gbps upload
or download at the time of delivery of the connection without the need for future hardware
upgrades or modification (excluding CPE � it is not mandatory to deploy 1Gbps capable CPE
from the outset if this is not required to deliver service)
2. deliver a minimum of 100Mbit/s to your premises. The upgraded broadband service must
deliver a �step change� in service which, for the avoidance of doubt, is at least a doubling of
speeds compared to the service currently being consumed by you.

AFAIK to upgrade existing FTTP lines from 330 Mbps to 500 Mbps (and beyond) requires Openreach to upgrade the GPON hardware, hence the £500+ one-off costs. I wonder if this means Openreach make all GBVS funded FTTP lines 1 Gig ready from the outset in order to meet the above T&Cs?

Edited by deleted (Tue 01-Jan-19 13:16:46)

In reply to a post by baby_frogmella:

Last time i checked, BT Wholesale tails are available nationwide, not just in certain regions.

Correct, in fact they are the only operator to provide 100% coverage at the copper level.

In reply to a post by baby_frogmella:

Syscomm and Fluidone, unlike Spectrum Internet for example, don't have their own LLU network so can offer their services nationwide subject to carrier availability (usually BT Wholesale).

Actually, we are operating in this capacity. Watch this space

In reply to a post by baby_frogmella:

However in the case of the gigabit services, its clearly Openreach who are dictating to the ISPs where they can sell their services, ie it appears just selected exchanges are enabled for Gigabit BTW based services.

I've tried to labour this point in my previous posts.
Openreach have absolutely no restrictions on 500 & 1Gb availability, other than ECI.
The Wholesale restrictions are wholly in their own control and are temporary.

My comment about our geography was two-fold.
Where we are operating, we can provide all speeds and all options listed by OR (native and on demand).
Where we aren't operating and therefore typically relying on wholesale, we're limited by:
- Wholesale product availability (as discussed)
- Market A.
- Cost of delivery for 500Mb & 1Gb services.

In reply to a post by baby_frogmella:

The main reason I am (or was!) interested in a Gigabit service from FluidOne was primarily to get significantly better upload speeds, 30 Mbps isn't that fast when you have to upload a few TBs of data at once so 220 Mbps upload would have been useful. Oh well I guess Openreach have to protect their leased line revenue so can't imagine them offering symmetrical speeds on FTTP anytime soon (if ever)

Again, not an Openreach restriction.
If you were in say, Leamington Spa, and wanted 1Gb FTTP, we could provide it to you within a few weeks.
Don't expect it to be massively cheaper than 1Gb symmetrical EAD however.

In reply to a post by baby_frogmella:

AFAIK to upgrade existing FTTP lines from 330 Mbps to 500 Mbps (and beyond) requires Openreach to upgrade the GPON hardware, hence the £500+ one-off costs. I wonder if this means Openreach make all GBVS funded FTTP lines 1 Gig ready from the outset in order to meet the above T&Cs?

Again, as mentioned earlier, no XGPON is deployed today.
The existing equipment can handle it already.
The £500 is banked to pay for upgrades once required later.

Anything post start of the voucher scheme is being provided on 1Gb capiable FTTP head-ends to ensure compatibility.

In reply to a post by Blmcg:

Openreach have absolutely no restrictions on 500 & 1Gb availability, other than ECI.
The Wholesale restrictions are wholly in their own control and are temporary.

Thanks for the clarification. Once the temporary restrictions have been lifted by Wholesale, does that mean you (and other CPs) will be able to provision 1 Gig services nationwide as long as the public Wholesale checker shows availability? I guess the costs are going to be potentailly eye watering but hopefully they will come down over time.

Edited by deleted (Tue 01-Jan-19 13:44:30)

In reply to a post by baby_frogmella:

Thanks for the clarification. Once the temporary restrictions have been lifted by Wholesale, does that mean you (and other CPs) will be able to provision 1 Gig services nationwide as long as the public Wholesale checker shows availability? I guess the costs are going to be potentailly eye watering but hopefully they will come down over time.

That's the hope. We're working closely with them, as a valued partner, to push for greater availability.

Wholesale are very keen for adoption of the higher rate services, the forward vision has been there for some time.
Technically, A LOT of investment is being made to upgrade the WBC core for ultra-fast and 10Gb port availability/exchange backhaul are just a part of that.
Red tape wise, old blockers are being challenged and market regulation is still a big part of this but it's getting traction.

You're starting to see the same challenges that appeared in the early FTTC days.
Sudden jumps from ~20Mb tails (average 10 lets say) to 40Mb and then 80Mb meant it was a while before anyone was really ready to provide. (Just look at TT/Voda for FTTP & G.Fast as an example).
That was a 2x or 4x peak increase, what we're looking at here is a 10x increase on top of that!

The entry points for equipment and backhaul just jumped up a gear, whereas you could go a long way on 1Gb hardware for some time now. In a lot of cases that's going to be satisfied by an in-place upgrade, but a full refresh.

The challenge here of course is that this is an ultra-low margin industry, to the extremes of the budget operators where if a customer calls with a fault in their contract lifetime their entire contract is a loss, not a fractional "profit".

Somewhere in that profit money has to be found to fund the required upgrades or increased capacity rentals to enable these products.

So I imagine you can see why it's not surprising why availability is limited.

Hopefully they'll get shot of the ECI OLTs, or at very least relegate them to only serving ECI FTTC cabinets.

On what planet does it make sense having kit that has GE backhaul ports and 2.4Gb/port line cards to the access network? Crazy.

In reply to a post by baby_frogmella:

As things stand it�s FTTP lines with Huawei GPON hardware which show up as 1000/220 on the BT checker, the ECI based lines still show 330/50. Whether the ECI kit can be upgraded easily to support higher speeds I�ve no idea....

No idea if mine was upgraded or not but I only had 330/50 available until about 3 weeks ago and now I have 1000/220 showing up on the Openreach checker, so something changed here at least.

Edited by deleted (Wed 02-Jan-19 14:59:55)

There are only 150 properties on our estate with FTTP. Crazy really. Is it the developers or Openreach who decide what infrastructure to install? Think the reason they may have reverted to copper is due to poor uptake of FTTP due to the availability of VM.

Anyway, there are a couple of Openreach engineers living on the estate - I�ll see if I can ask them if they can get 1000/220 at home, as I know they get the fastest available connection for free as a perk of the job. Does a 1000 connection absolutely need an XGPON card in the headend or can it be delivered over a 2.5G fibre using existing ONT if there were sufficient capacity?

It's entirely down to what the developer orders.

It was confirmed earlier in the thread that they are NOT currently using XG-PON except in trials.
1000/220 can be delivered over the current GPON provided it is a Huawei Head end in the exchange. It will be upgraded to XG-PON when capacity deems it necessary.

In reply to a post by germanbear:

There are only 150 properties on our estate with FTTP. Crazy really.

Not crazy at all from the developer's perspective. As John says, its the developer who requests connectivity from Openreach. Usually copper is cheaper however in recent years Openreach have offered fibre at no extra cost provided the developer is building at least 30 plots - though the initial criteria was 100 homes. So if some homes on your estate are copper only, then it would have been cheaper for the developer to provide copper instead of fibre to those homes at the time, ie either the Openreach scheme had NOT started or the developer did not meet the scheme criteria when those copper only houses were being built. Most - if not all - developers will choose copper over fibre if its cheaper.

Agreed, there is only about 8 people with FTTP and there is a max of 23 homes which are on our phone pole that can get FTTP and that's it on our Splitter Node, the top half of our road can also get FTTP but that's via a different Splitter Node located round the corner from me.

BT loves to roll out FTTP like a patch work quilt, a bit here and leave the rest of the road, some more there and then leave the rest of that road, even though all the fibre hardware is in place, however I am not fully sure how many fibres going into our Splitter Node, it might be only 1 which would explain why, but I know there was loads coming out of it.

As for VM, there is no chance in hell in VM coming down our road, our road and side roads are a conservation area, so no chance in getting cabinets installed down the roads.

Good luck in getting multiple 1Gbps connection down 2.5Gb fibre, its split 32 ways at the Splitter Node so if all 32 connection started downloading a 20 GB file at the same time then all connections (assuming a single download per connection) would get a max speed of just over 78Mbps.

Paul

In reply to a post by PaulKirby:

Good luck in getting multiple 1Gbps connection down 2.5Gb fibre, its split 32 ways at the Splitter Node so if all 32 connection started downloading a 20 GB file at the same time then all connections (assuming a single download per connection) would get a max speed of just over 78Mbps.

Which of course is tragically slow .

And is how Gigabit over GPON is done in many other countries

In reply to a post by RobertoS:

In reply to a post by PaulKirby:

Good luck in getting multiple 1Gbps connection down 2.5Gb fibre, its split 32 ways at the Splitter Node so if all 32 connection started downloading a 20 GB file at the same time then all connections (assuming a single download per connection) would get a max speed of just over 78Mbps.

Which of course is tragically slow .

LOL
Well it is when you are paying for 330Mbps, but yeah I see your point.

If I was on FTTC I would be getting a max speed (according to BTOR) of 69.45Mbps (down), 20Mbps (up) which is still good, but that speed would be if my line was good, sadly its not, especially when it gets windy or when it rains.

Paul

Ditton Priors exchange got WBC FTTP 1000/220 in Bridgnorth Shropshire served by Cabinet 2 (WV16 6SE)

Openreach FTTP infrastructure has nothing to do with their copper cabinets Max

WBC FTTP 1000/220 via FTTP on Demand

But FTTPoD has nothing to do with the cabs either.

Address SERENDIPITY, MONKHOPTON, BRIDGNORTH, WV16 6SE on Exchange DITTON PRIORS is served by Cabinet 2

Featured Products


Downstream Line Rate(Mbps)


Upstream Line Rate(Mbps)


Downstream Range(Mbps)


WBC FTTP Availability Date


FTTP on Demand 1000 220 -- Available

Yes, the checker shows which copper cabinet the address is connected to.

But FTTP/FTTPoD does NOT touch the cabinet in any way shape or form.

In reply to a post by baby_frogmella:

In reply to a post by germanbear:

There are only 150 properties on our estate with FTTP. Crazy really.

Not crazy at all from the developer's perspective. As John says, its the developer who requests connectivity from Openreach. Usually copper is cheaper however in recent years Openreach have offered fibre at no extra cost provided the developer is building at least 30 plots - though the initial criteria was 100 homes. So if some homes on your estate are copper only, then it would have been cheaper for the developer to provide copper instead of fibre to those homes at the time, ie either the Openreach scheme had NOT started or the developer did not meet the scheme criteria when those copper only houses were being built. Most - if not all - developers will choose copper over fibre if its cheaper.

Trust me, it is crazy. They pulled 8km of 36 core fibre as there was no headend at our nearest exchange, to only serve 150 properties! Imagine what the cost was to do that. They have then reverted to copper for the final phase of the development, around another 100 properties, with not even FTTC on offer. I think it is to do with the presence of VM on the whole estate and the poor take-up of FTTP, even though it is a far better product. Are Openreach obliged to install a line, be it copper or fibre, if VM is on offer, as to do not do so would mean that VM had a monopoly?

As for good luck getting 1Gbps, I reckon I would be fine here, as I've just about got my own dedicated fibre back to the exchange! Even with 32 subscribers on one 2.5Gb fibre, the likelihood that everyone will simultaneously burst at full speed is unlikely. Unless they were all on Ultrafast with the 100 speed guarantee and orchestrated a simultaneous speedtest in order to get the £20.

Your case and Paul's are very very different with absolutely no relevance to each other.
Paul's area isn't a brand spanking new development. They rolled FTTP equipment out to his area then abandoned it for FTTC.
He emailed the CEO and got his FTTP enabled.

You're in a new development.
OpenReach deliver what the developer orders.

What makes you think they pulled the fibre 8km?
Even if it was an OpenReach engineer who told you that, take it with a VERY small pinch of salt.
While many engineers know their stuff, others come out with huge whoppers.

We had someone on the FTTPoD thread yesterday get told by the OpenReach surveyor of all people "Your fibre install should be straight forward as you get 70Mb+ so you must be near the cabinet."
The fibre doesn't even come from the cabinet.
If the guy surveying the route doesn't know where the source is don't be surprised if the guy working on your estate had no idea where the fibre originated.

It doesn't come from the local exchange or the nearest Head-End but the nearest Fibre Aggregation Node.
Unless there's no FTTC cabinets within 8km then the chances they took the fibre from so far away is pretty small.

Edited by j0hn83 (Fri 04-Jan-19 11:55:22)

I'm totally confident in the information I have. The engineer I spoke to on site here, was on the new sites team who did the install on our site. The exchange he told me it comes from is the one which it tells me I am on from the BTW checker, which is 7.36km by road from my house.... He said it didn't come from our nearest exchange as there is no fibre headend there.

In reply to a post by germanbear:

I'm totally confident in the information I have. The engineer I spoke to on site here, was on the new sites team who did the install on our site. The exchange he told me it comes from is the one which it tells me I am on from the BTW checker, which is 7.36km by road from my house.... He said it didn't come from our nearest exchange as there is no fibre headend there.

Did you read my message? None of it comes from exchanges. They come from Fibre Aggregation Nodes.

The fibre may indeed be lit from a distant headend, but that doesn't necessarily mean that they pulled fibre all the way from there. They would have taken fibre from the nearest fibre aggregation node.

FTTC cabinets are also served from fibre aggregation nodes; so if you have any FTTC cabinets serving nearby areas, then there is almost certainly a fibre aggregation node somewhere nearby. (If there wasn't, they would have installed one while deploying the FTTC cabinets)

germanbear

For any residential scenario it is pretty irrelevant anyway. Most PCs cannot cope with 1Gbps for more than a second or two so will slow down the acks while the hard disk copes. (Even SSDs will slow the transfer rate.) Also most ( not all) distant sources will not feed a single customer with 1Gbps as they will be timesharing their capacity across multiple customers. Getting 8-10 PCs all streaming HD will still only hit 400Mb so normal long time period use will not be that bad and 8+ PCs is not the normal family scenario.

Downloading 100Gb games is always limited by the distant ends ( Even on steam) so not a constant 1Gbps.

Only the best speedtest sites will cope with sending Gbps streams so speedtests are the most likely to saturate a connection, especially doing multiple at a time on each connection. ( Even these limit the number of tests at a time as otherwise their connection becomes the limiting factor and affects the result!, this is why not so good ones give variable results, their connection is the weak spot!)

Business use is a different matter when downloading / uploading from a business server but even then unless running a multi person business ( or a server site) you are unlikely to have the ability to saturate the connection for minutes at a time. ISPs T&Cs usually bar claims for these scenarios.

I agree, even worst case would be to the nearest exchange manhole that would have fibre to serve all the other equipment in the building!

There are very few exchanges without fibre, usually those with exchange activate only services. Any exchange with WBC ( outside Scottish Islands which can be radio fed with fibre from the aerial to building!) certainly has fibre and has had for years.

LOLing at the fact that you know more than the Openreach engineers who have actually had their hands on the infrastructure on our estate. In fact, another engineer who came to fix the copper line in our previous property a few weeks before we moved, also told me the exact same info that the fibre was pulled 8km from the Peartree exchange, not our closest exchange, Mickleover. They must have been colluding to give me fake news.

I get the aggregation node bit, but they are fed from exchanges.... When you enter one of the properties on here which has FTTP into the BTW checker, it says it comes from the Peartree exchange. When you enter the address of a copper property, in some cases directly opposite or next door to an FTTP property, it says Mickleover exchange. Explain this....

because the fibre originates at that Head-End.... but it isn't pulled in 1 giant length from there.

There are fibre aggregation nodes inbetween, roughly 1 for every 3 or 4 FTTC cabinets.
Unless you have no FTTC cabinets for the 8km between you and the head-end.... which is unlikely.

I wasn't arguing with you over where the fibre originates, just trying to be helpful and educate that it isn't pulled from there.
It comes from fibre Aggregation Nodes which will be much closer.

In reply to a post by adslmax:

Ditton Priors exchange got WBC FTTP 1000/220 in Bridgnorth Shropshire served by Cabinet 2 (WV16 6SE)

Only 1 address on that postcode shows that speed, 3 show the 330:30 and 2 show no fibre at all.
So I am thinking it might be a mistake.

Paul

Agreed.

When I copy very large files to our in house servers over a Gbit LAN here I will see about 800 to 850Mbps at max.
This is not the drives, they are capable for that speeds, but in this case its the Lan Cards being just a Gbit due to the headers in the network packets etc.

So I am also guessing it would be the same for 1Gbit Fibre, that would be why I would never get the 1Gbit if BT was selling it, sure the 550:165 and that would be just for the up stream.

Paul

Got 330/50 from Cerberus.

The checker spits out this:

Our records show the following FTTP network service information for these premises:- Multi Dwelling Unit Residential UG Feed with no anticipated issues.

ONT exists with active service. A spare port is available. Network is at capacity so a new ONT cannot be ordered.

I assume that is one of the market/wholesale restrictions due to capacity?

In reply to a post by mauimauer:

Got 330/50 from Cerberus.

The checker spits out this:

Our records show the following FTTP network service information for these premises:- Multi Dwelling Unit Residential UG Feed with no anticipated issues.

ONT exists with active service. A spare port is available. Network is at capacity so a new ONT cannot be ordered.

I assume that is one of the market/wholesale restrictions due to capacity?

I think that means your fibre DP is full or the exchange has ran out of ports. Obviously it doesn't affect you, unless ordering a 2nd FTTP line.

Edit: Need to visit Specsavers!

Edited by deleted (Mon 14-Jan-19 12:05:35)

In reply to a post by mauimauer:

Got 330/50 from Cerberus.

The checker spits out this:

Our records show the following FTTP network service information for these premises:- Multi Dwelling Unit Residential UG Feed with no anticipated issues.

ONT exists with active service. A spare port is available. Network is at capacity so a new ONT cannot be ordered.

I assume that is one of the market/wholesale restrictions due to capacity?

In your case, surely it should say for you the following:

ONT exists with active service. A spare port is not available. Network is at capacity so a new ONT cannot be ordered.

The reason that I say that is due to if its at capacity then there is not a free port.
Unless the free port part is referring to the spare fibres that get blown from the DP in the chamber to the CSP on the property wall (assuming its the old 2 stage install) then yeah there will be 3 spare ports.

But yeah, I was wondering that the other day, due to there are about at max 6 fibres used on our pole leaving a possible 26 fibre strands assuming they will install an additional DP and manifold(s) at the top of the pole to cater for the remaining fibres.

I know this due to our pole is the only one connected to our Splitter Node, the top half of our road and its side roads all use a different Splitter Node located round the corner.

Which is why I think we are seeing the following for our address:

Our records show the following FTTP network service information for these premises:- Single Dwelling Unit Residential OH Feed with no anticipated issues.

ONT exists with active service. A spare port is available. A new ONT may be ordered.

So hopefully that will allow if we wanted to get additional FTTP connections (not that we need to) and also where we are seeing 1000:220 which will allow for faster speeds once BT decide to start selling the Ultrafast 3 and 4 products.

But I think 300 - 330Mbps (down stream) is fine but to be honest I wouldn't mind more upstream, but at the moment what we have is fine.

Paul

Edited by PaulKirby (Mon 14-Jan-19 12:16:22)

You don't have a 4-port ONT do you? In case that's the "spare ports" it's talking about.

In reply to a post by candlerb:

You don't have a 4-port ONT do you? In case that's the "spare ports" it's talking about.

Ah, forgot about the other 3 ports on the ONT, yeah I do.

Paul

FWIW, my exchange (NDLEY) showed up as having:

FTTP on Demand 330 30

on the BT checker. Now that my FTTPoD order is nearing completion, it's changed to:

FTTP on Demand 1000 220

The neighbouring houses connected to my pole and the next pole along the road have also changed to say the same things. Houses in the neighbouring roads (and the pub at the end of my road) still say 330/30.

So, if someone else on the same exchange had been checking the odds are they'd still be seeing 330/30, blissfully unaware that it's actually capable of 1000/220 connections.

I would imagine this is a relatively common situation in the world of FTTPoD at least!

As I understand it: BT Wholesale only used to offer a 330/30 FTTPoD product. Now they also offer a 1000/220 and a 500/165. But you won't see the change until a property's database entry is updated for some reason.

In reply to a post by candlerb:

As I understand it: BT Wholesale only used to offer a 330/30 FTTPoD product. Now they also offer a 1000/220 and a 500/165. But you won't see the change until a property's database entry is updated for some reason.

FTTP On Demand on BT Wholesale is only available up to a max of 330/30, despite what the DSL checker may show. In the OPs case its an error on the database and should be cleared up once the OP goes live. Then it will most likely change to 'FTTP WBC 1000/220' (and likely his neighbours as well).

Edited by deleted (Tue 21-May-19 10:11:46)

My FTTP availability has recently changed from 330/30 to 1000/220, around 4 Months into my FTTPoD contract, so either BT are upgrading exchanges or it's just a database catchup

In reply to a post by lincsat:

My FTTP availability has recently changed from 330/30 to 1000/220, around 4 Months into my FTTPoD contract, so either BT are upgrading exchanges or it's just a database catchup

Well if the head end was Huawei but it lacked backhaul at 10G then its possible that this has now been upgraded.

Now that OR have released their faster consumer tier pricing thought I would revist this topic.

I've had my WBC FTTP for comming up to 1 year now, BTW checker still lists the maximum as 330/50, yet I have seen other properties on the same exchange (and same cabinet, but don't really think that has much to do with it) that report 1000/200.

I'm still confused as to exactly what is restricting my maximum to 330. If others on the exchange are showing 1000/200 then I assume the exchange doesn't have ECI OLT. Would other addresses connected on the same cabinet, be connected to the same Aggregation Node too? Or is that where the issue might lie?

I am assuming that if the checker is saying 330/50 then once the 500 and 1000 consumer tiers become avaialble to order from ISP's i'll be in a 'computer says no' position. Pretty much like the last 10 years before we finally got FTTP

Your FTTP line might be connected to an ECI OLT at the exchange whilst those who can get 1000/220 are connected to a Huawei OLT at the same exchange - I believe Openreach can/do use both at the same exchange. Then there's also the issue of FTTP hardware used between the exchange and your home (not fttc cabs!) - the kit used by your circuit may not support the higher speeds. TBH for 99.99% of users, its a bit of a non-issue and when the day comes that 330 Mbps isn't enough for the average punter, Openreach will have upgraded the kit on the 'slower' FTTP lines well before then.

The back of your ONT would be a huge giveaway.
If it's an ECI ONT then it's connected to ECI equipment.

I don't think they mix and match vendors on FTTP kit.

Records aren't automatically upgraded for every property to show the higher tiers so not necessarily ECI kit.

Its only the very first (1st gen) Openreach ONTs which are ECI - they were first released around 2012. Gen 2 & 3 are all Huawei and the 330/50 limit also applies to some with a Huawei ONT installed.

Edited by deleted (Thu 19-Sep-19 13:52:13)

In reply to a post by baby_frogmella:

Its only the very first (1st gen) Openreach ONTs which are ECI - they were first released around 2012. Gen 2 & 3 are all Huawei and the 330/50 limit still exists even with those using Huawei ONTs.

I'm aware of the newer generations of ONT's from Huawei, for the Huawei OLT's.

Any 330/50 limit for users with Huawei ONT's does not mean they must be on ECI Head-Ends.

A quote from the knowledgeable Carl recently.

BT will provision Nokia ONTs with Nokia OLTs.

They will provision Huawei ONTs with Huawei OLTs.

Sadly they will provision ECI ONTs with ECI OLTs.

GPON provisioning is not standardised. Operators do it in their own proprietary way so Openreach don�t mix and match vendors across the PON. To do so complicates provisioning and loses them a bunch of visibility, management and telemetry.

With that in mind this is the new Huawei ONT. The new Nokia one is for Nokia ONTs. The same ECI kit for the awful ECI OLT configuration.

Manufacturers are unlikely to provide ways to use another ONT on their OLT. Why would they when they can make the £££ selling every ONT connecting to their kit instead?

This has always been my understanding of the situation.

edit: according to OpenReach only 50,000 on the ECI FTTP kit so no surprise you don't see much and usually see the newer ONT's.

Edited by j0hn83 (Thu 19-Sep-19 13:54:00)

I know mine is the 4 data port Huawei version.

But are you sure the 2012 models are all ECI?
Our exchange is using Huawei hardware and half of my area was upgraded back in 2011 - 2012.

Paul

Looking at these pics of the gen1 ONT, its got a manufacture date of 2012:

https://thecomputerperson.wordpress.com/2015/03/01/t...

I would add don't trust the BT Wholesale checker...there appears to be areas where Openreach side is all Giga capable but BT Wholesale is just showing the 330 product

So if some in area can order 1000 service and you are trying to place an order and cannot (rather than worrying whether you might) then ISP needs to pass things on up the chain for someone to double check.

In reply to a post by baby_frogmella:

Looking at these pics of the gen1 ONT, its got a manufacture date of 2012:

https://thecomputerperson.wordpress.com/2015/03/01/t...

I wasn't saying they are not ECI ONT's, I was just saying some ONT's back in 2011 - 2012 must of been Huawei also due to my area were originally upgraded back in 2011 - 2012 and they have the 4 port ONT's like mine.

Mine and the rest of my area have ONT's like >> this <<, I would of taken a photo of mine but we have a sideboard right next to it so I would need to pull it all out to take a photo.

Paul

Fair enough, in that case Openreach may have been installing both the ECI & Huawei ONTs around 2012. Otherwise it seems strange to see an ECI ONT with a manufacture date of Sept 2012 if no ECI kit was being installed around that time.

My ONT is Huawei

So if my ONT is Huawei, then the limiting factor is not due to ECI OLT. Thanks.

My main concern is after being stuck with poor broadband for a long time, now I've finally got FTTP, I don't want to be in a situation where I'm limited again in the near future.

I'll wait for the faster consumer services to become available and then pester BT for database updates.

A couple of general questions not directed at any specific person.

I thought all newly installed ONT's by Openreach were Huawei so am I correct in thinking this?

There are still a lot of ECI OLT's out there so what happens if someone orders FTTP today and their local infrastructure (e.g. Splitter, CBT) runs back to a ECI OLT what ONT do they get? I'm thinking Huawei but am I correct?

Edited by deleted (Thu 19-Sep-19 17:30:01)

In reply to a post by dect:

I thought all newly installed ONT's by Openreach were Huawei so am I correct in thinking this?

Correct, the current 1+1 gen 3 ONT is Huawei. The upcoming gen 4 looks identical to gen 3 but without the outer casing + BBU. Also I think its 1+0 (no voice port)

In reply to a post by dect:

There are still a lot of ECI OLT's out there so what happens if someone orders FTTP today and their local infrastructure (e.g. Splitter, CBT) runs back to a ECI OLT what ONT do they get? I'm thinking Huawei but am I correct?

It would make sense for Openreach to use the same manufacturer at both ends (ONT + OLT) but I'm not sure if that's really the case everywhere. For example, near me there are 2 new FTTP only estates which only went up a few years ago so they will all have 2nd or 3rd gen ONTs, ie all Huawei's. Yet, despite both estates being fed from the same exchange in town, one site can't get more than 330/50 yet the other one can get the full 1000/220. Bedrock is seeing something similar and it may well be an Openreach database error but I have my doubts.

I thought all newly installed ONT's by Openreach were Huawei so am I correct in thinking this?

Only if the OLT is Huawei.

There are still a lot of ECI OLT's out there so what happens if someone orders FTTP today and their local infrastructure (e.g. Splitter, CBT) runs back to a ECI OLT what ONT do they get? I'm thinking Huawei but am I correct?

My understanding is they would get an ECI ONT.

In reply to a post by j0hn83:

My understanding is they would get an ECI ONT.

No one I've asked seems to be 100% sure thats why I asked the question here.

Do Openreach still stock ECI ONTs?

I've also been told that a Huawei ONT will work on a ECI OLT although some of the proprietary stuff will be lost but the basic functionality for FTTP will still work.