BT replacing all V1 VDSL Modems or just Infinity Customers ?

It seems that BT are replacing all pre Aug 2011 VDSL modems for their Infinity customers, presumably because of the overheating problems, but is this being extended to folk (like me !) using another ISP for their FTTC service ?

http://community.bt.com/t5/BT-Infinity/Infinity-Mode...

Edited by broadbandjockey (Sat 21-Jan-12 17:53:12)

Yes, it's going to everyone

It's BT Openreach replacing all the modems for their FTTC service. This affects all of BT Openreach's customers, being BT Retail (i.e. infinity), Plusnet, AAISP, etc etc.

I'm happy wiv my original one fanks guv .

I don't like the reports of some replacements being noticeably slower, and I only just get into 40Mbps.

Edited by RobertoS (Sat 21-Jan-12 21:20:19)

In reply to a post by RobertoS:

I'm happy wiv my original one fanks guv .

I don't like the reports of some replacements being noticeably slower, and I only just get into 40Mbps.

Oh !

Well, same here. Mine been fine (as far as I know) since day 1 (Sept 2010)

I'm in no rush to get it replaced, runs cool as I have it wall mounted, so if it 'aint broke, don't fix it !

In reply to a post by RobertoS:

I'm happy wiv my original one fanks guv .

I don't like the reports of some replacements being noticeably slower, and I only just get into 40Mbps.

Same here, it has been running since April '11, so just over 9 months now and it has been fine. It is sat on a small bookcase, it is warm but not too hot to touch.

Just to let you know RobertoS that I have had a new 3B modem and my speeds are the same as they were prior to the exchange (37.48Mb prior, and after).
I hope I am not in a minority though, and these new modems last and don't give speed issues.
My original modem failed, but it didn't even get warm and was always on it's side.

Most do seem to be OK. In fact it's a while since I saw a "slower" report, but there were several in the first phase of the mass replacement. May have been a bad batch, but still, if it ain't bust, don't fix it!

The good side of it, if and when I get a new one, is that some people manage to hang onto the old one as well. If I manage that, one of them is going to get hacked for the stats .

Me too. Still waiting to be contacted though.

DrT

In reply to a post by RobertoS:

The good side of it, if and when I get a new one, is that some people manage to hang onto the old one as well. If I manage that, one of them is going to get hacked for the stats .

They may me wise to that...

When my first Modem died, the OR Engineer took the old one away for exchange with the suppliers under Warranty.

And bribing the technician will not work either!

So are we...and we were rather early customers

Getting mine done on Monday.....

In reply to a post by tcbandituk:

Getting mine done on Monday.....

They are doing mine Sunday. (29th)

Hi TC, not heard from you on here for a while, how's things with your FTTC service ? I recall you having a few probs after it was 'installed'.

Well.. mine went pop last year.. not physically but it was the modem that failed.
It was even mounted vertically as suggested by the engineer to help with the heat dissipation.

BT replaced it with the new one and all good, same speeds.

You may want to replace it just to save the few days of down time potentially at some point.

In reply to a post by Zarjaz:

Hi TC, not heard from you on here for a while, how's things with your FTTC service ? I recall you having a few probs after it was 'installed'.

Hi Zarjaz ,

Well, it's never been good at staying connected for any length of time, whenever I check the uptime it's never been more than a couple of days it seems.
It's a bit of a pain when working occasionally but it always reconnects immediately so I put up with it.
It's the only real problem I have had hence I've been quiet on here

Maybe the new modem will help !

TC

Edited by deleted (Tue 24-Jan-12 21:01:33)

Maybe the new modem will help !

Could be, let me know.

The Kelly communications guy has just been (early too), so I have a new 3B modem (curiously they have been told that it is not necessary to change the psu - just the modem). Speeds are exactly the same as before. So far it does not seem to get as warm as the previous modem (it is still on the bookcase).

Sync is 39998/10000 and IP profile is unchanged at 38716/10000. (yes it has been hacked already).

Did you manage to keep the old one as a spare?

No, the guy took it with him .

(curiously they have been told that it is not necessary to change the psu - just the modem).

That is 100% wrong ! They have been given a simple task, and are ballsing it up [sad]

In reply to a post by TheHorseman:

curiously they have been told that it is not necessary to change the psu - just the modem

When I got fibre installed in my new flat, the Openreach guy had the new modem - didn't want the old one (from the old house) back - but specifically wanted to mount the new one vertically, and specifically wanted to use the new PSU (in a white case, not black).

In reply to a post by WWWombat:

In reply to a post by TheHorseman:

curiously they have been told that it is not necessary to change the psu - just the modem

When I got fibre installed in my new flat, the Openreach guy had the new modem - didn't want the old one (from the old house) back - but specifically wanted to mount the new one vertically, and specifically wanted to use the new PSU (in a white case, not black).

That's the difference between an Openreach engineer and a subcontractor's technician (from Kelly Communications) for you.

Actually I'm a bit concerned about the Subject.

Wouldn't Infinity Customers be a bit unhappy at being replaced?

In reply to a post by burakkucat:

In reply to a post by WWWombat:

In reply to a post by TheHorseman:

curiously they have been told that it is not necessary to change the psu - just the modem

When I got fibre installed in my new flat, the Openreach guy had the new modem - didn't want the old one (from the old house) back - but specifically wanted to mount the new one vertically, and specifically wanted to use the new PSU (in a white case, not black).

That's the difference between an Openreach engineer and a subcontractor's technician (from Kelly Communications) for you.

To be pedantic, the Openreach staff are Technicians and the Kelly Comms staff are box stackers and delivery drivers.

Just had a look at the PSUs.

The Black is rated at 12v 0.7A whereas the White is 12v 1.0A

I have successfully run a 3B modem with a Black PSU for about 10 days without any noticeable change in performance.

However, I wonder if the requirement is based on future performance as greater processing power will be required for demodulating incoming 80Mbps data stream when compared with current 40Mbps and even more if BT move to a 30A profile, similarly, the additional processing power for creating the upstream at 20Mbps compared to 10Mbps. And finally, moving from a 10Mbps upstream to 20Mbps will require extra power across the wider spectrum.

In reply to a post by Zarjaz:

Maybe the new modem will help !

Could be, let me know.

Replacement went easy enough, took 10 minutes, the PSU was replaced with the white one and it reconnected fairly quickly.
The guy who installed it commented that he didn't think my HH2 broadband light should be flashing as much as it does ?
Download and upload speed appears to be about the same.
It stayed up for a couple of hours then dropped the connection and immediately reconnected, I'll see how long it stays up now......

Edited by deleted (Mon 30-Jan-12 20:13:48)

I didn't recall you had an HH2, might be worth trying an HH3.

In reply to a post by Zarjaz:

I didn't recall you had an HH2, might be worth trying an HH3.

4 days and counting with just the modem replacement

That's good news. Not entirely surprised, seen so many of the V2's be the cause of problems. I do feel a tad guilty, but let's hope you are problem free now.

Have come home to find out that my PSU has not been swapped either. No Issues but i have written a letter to Kelly Comms expressing a concern in the differnt AMPS / Volts and asked for a new PSU to be supplied will Let everyone know the outcome

Darren

The current capability is higher on the white PSU I believe and depending on the current draw of the modem could make the older PSU prone to early failure. They should really have changed it with the modem. It could have been interesting if the new modem ran at a lower voltage.

In reply to a post by Anonymous:

Have come home to find out that my PSU has not been swapped either

Me too. Why do half a job, just to save a few seconds?

We've just given the OK for Openreach (Kelly Communications) to contact our customers to replace their modems where required so we will contact our customers in due time but just a heads up for anyone who is with ADSL24 FTTC.

James

I am on bt infinity and had my v1 modem replaced by kelly yesterday, because of this thread I was aware they might not change the PSU so waited to see if he did, he did not so I stopped him and the conversation went like this..

Me: Have you changed the PSU? ( Stupid question, I'm standing right there.. I can see he hasn't )
Kelly: No would you like me to? ( he didn't sound too keen )
Me: Yes please. ( While he was changeing it I explain that I'd heard the new PSU's have a higher amp rating (thanks to you fellas in this thread ) )
Kelly: We are told we don't have to replace them.

Unfortunatly I didn't think to ask if it was Openreach that told him he doesn't have to change the PSU.

After he had gone I noticed the higher amp rating is also listed on the back of the modem too, versions 1, 2 and 3 have 0.7A on the label but the v4 has 1A:
v4 (3B) Modem Label
v4 (3B) PSU Label
v1 Modem Label

I asked if he would leave me a spare 3B but he wasn't allowed to and also took the old modem away ( put it back in the box in place of the new one so I guess it's going back to huawei )

The white PSU is slightly bigger than the black one and the lead is thicker/less flimsy, overall it feels better quality.

Speed and IP Profile are the same, the admin interface seems to load faster, attainable rates are very slightly higher and don't drop as much during the evening although, that could just be because of the time of the resync, 13:30 vs 3AM of the last one.

My before and after stats are in the zip bellow for anyone interested, if you spot anything interesting I'd love to hear it.

Before-After-Modem-Change.zip

Thanks.

So you did get it going.

Took me 18 hours of pratting about.

http://forums.thinkbroadband.com/fibre/4083372-huawe...


Better max speeds than me then.

I find the graphs pretty but not sure what I am looking at. Would notice if something over a period of time gets worse and use as ammo when ringing up india call centre ( hard work and don't get me going on that.).

I have the old black one and been going since when ever the thing was changed as trouble with the phone line under the ground so bt guy came to have a look and changed the box to the 2B one.

So they might fail, got 1.5A ones for 2 external hard disks and a 7 inch telly we have in the tent. Will do until an ebay purchase arrives.

Not worth spending time hanging around for a new one to be bought. Unless a new 3B modem or higher arrives on the end of the PSU!.

A fix on ebay or amazon for not much, got a spare for the telly as it died and was sharing 2 PSU between 3 things as got the telly in the kitchen (might as well get used at home as well I thought). Cost £5 from hong kong and does my 1.5A telly ok so an amp one of 12V, easy fix.

Hopefully will be ok, wander if the internet slows and so rubbish modem or router but is the black PSU slowly dying, I will remember these comments and first thing will try if modem is dead, got 1.5A to prove a point. plug looks the same and would check polarity before blowing up a good modem!.

Nice to comment on your graphs but don't really know what I am looking at, at least Paul stuck with it and I got going, Might prove this PSU dying fault one day.
Lowering profiles and lots of errors.

All good stuff.

First to download it said but no comment guv, I know nothing.

Can replace my wife to a younger model if they wish

In reply to a post by Anonymous:

Can replace my wife to a younger model if they wish

And, just like the PSUs, "beefed up" by 50%?

In reply to a post by Daniel_g:

Took me 18 hours of pratting about.

So you keep saying and as Paul has already told you, a new setup routine is in the works.

In reply to a post by Croftie:

After he had gone I noticed the higher amp rating is also listed on the back of the modem too, versions 1, 2 and 3 have 0.7A on the label but the v4 has 1A:
v4 (3B) Modem Label
v4 (3B) PSU Label
v1 Modem Label

Thanks Croftie, for going to the trouble of doing all that

If anyone finds themselves in need of an urgent replacement...

"The DC plug dimensions are 5.5mm (OD) x 2.1mm (ID) x 10mm (L), with the centre tip 12v positive."

cheers, a

In reply to a post by Zarjaz:

That's good news. Not entirely surprised, seen so many of the V2's be the cause of problems. I do feel a tad guilty, but let's hope you are problem free now.

10 1/2 days up now, it was obviously the problem as nothing else has changed......

Likewise

btw I think I have a new part number, will post a comment to your blog shortly.

Edited by deleted (Fri 10-Feb-12 22:59:10)

Replaced mine today , didnt want to replace power pack as they have been told by BT not to , I mentioned the girl on the phone said modem and power pack and he swapped it.

He also said BT were sending some out that had no replacement power packs in the box.

So, three different actions by kelly then:

1. Not replace PSU saying they have been told they don't have to.
2. Not replace PSU saying they have been specificly told not too.
3. Replace the PSU without being asked to and even mentioned they had 800.000 to replace [1]

So are EU going to be in the same situation down the line, where instead of modems failing it's the PSU's? I guess time will tell, at least a PSU is easily replaceable.

[1] http://www.cupofcoffee.co.uk/2012/01/30/another-day-... (see comments)

Had miy modem swapped today. The guy didn;t swap the PSU.
I asked if he would but the reply was that the replacements come without the PSU and cables.

He also did a line test? - Used our phone to make a call. Not sure what this line test was as he had not test equipment.
Whole job took about five minutes.

In reply to a post by Anonymous:

Had miy modem swapped today. The guy didn;t swap the PSU.
I asked if he would but the reply was that the replacements come without the PSU and cables.

Rubbish - I have seen quite a few replacements and all have been supplied with the PSU, it is in the box. I wonder if there is a little scam going on to sell the PSUs elsewhere?

More like BT have agreed to pay Kelly Communications such a pitiful amount for each visit that just to save time the 'engineers' just swap the modem as quick as they can and get out of there.

Still waiting for mine...

Can one insist that the PSU is replaced? Can anybody authoritatively state what BTO has actually contracted Kelly to do?

DrT

Edited by deleted (Fri 17-Feb-12 16:27:49)

They do it for the purpose of ACTA.

In reply to a post by Anonymous:

They do it for the purpose of ACTA.

And what exactly is ACTA? Anti Counterfeiting Trade Agreement? Association of Cardiothoracic Anaesthetists?!

Avoiding Customer Trust Agnoticism.
Avoiding Customers Telephoning Angrily.

In reply to a post by tcbandituk:

In reply to a post by Zarjaz:

That's good news. Not entirely surprised, seen so many of the V2's be the cause of problems. I do feel a tad guilty, but let's hope you are problem free now.

10 1/2 days up now, it was obviously the problem as nothing else has changed......

It lasted 24 days and has reset the connection today

In reply to a post by MHC:

In reply to a post by Anonymous:

Had miy modem swapped today. The guy didn;t swap the PSU.
I asked if he would but the reply was that the replacements come without the PSU and cables.

Rubbish - I have seen quite a few replacements and all have been supplied with the PSU, it is in the box. I wonder if there is a little scam going on to sell the PSUs elsewhere?

Had mine replaced yesterday, i had a Tweet from BT saying they're meant to swap the PSU and to let him know how it goes...
The guy who replaced the modem said he'd been told by BT to only replace the PSU at the customers request and that he had over 100 in his van.

not heard one thing about them coming and replacing my modem been on BT Infinity for nearly 18months now??

In reply to a post by MrGrumpy:

not heard one thing about them coming and replacing my modem been on BT Infinity for nearly 18months now??

Just got a letter today and have an appointment for Monday after 17:00 hrs.

Still trying to find out for sure if the PSU should be replaced too.

DrT

In reply to a post by DrTeeth:

In reply to a post by MrGrumpy:

not heard one thing about them coming and replacing my modem been on BT Infinity for nearly 18months now??

Just got a letter today and have an appointment for Monday after 17:00 hrs.

Still trying to find out for sure if the PSU should be replaced too.

DrT

BT say they are supposed to replace it.

In reply to a post by DrTeeth:

Still trying to find out for sure if the PSU should be replaced too.

Ask for it to be replaced and it should be, they are unlikely to volunteer.

This question has been asked to the bods in charge, the answer is that modems initially came as a full pack, but they are now being replaced modem only (as supplied). Changes made by direct labour will involve the PSU as OR engineers are issued with new provision kits - not warranty replacements. It is thought that the power supply is not an issue when left insitu (but it is still mandatory that BT engineers replace whole unit as process is kit to be sent off for testing).
-OE

Thanks for all the replies.

DrT

Insist that they do replace it.

In reply to a post by Zarjaz:

Insist that they do replace it.

I will do my best, but what happens if they won't or say that they haven't got any...refuse the modem swap? This is why I am trying to find with 110% certainty what is supposed to be supplied as in what BT OR has contracted for.

DrT

In reply to a post by DrTeeth:

I will do my best, but what happens if they won't or say that they haven't got any...refuse the modem swap? This is why I am trying to find with 110% certainty what is supposed to be supplied as in what BT OR has contracted for.

At the end of the day, does it *really* matter. I never got given the new power supply last Thursday when I got the modem replaced and had I read this thread earlier I might well have asked. The one I had before is still working fine and if it fails at some point in the future then BT will provide a new one at that time.

Please consider the power rating of the old versus the new PSUs --

Old: 12V @ 0.7A (8.4W max)
New: 12V @ 1A (12W max)

Now look at the label on the underside of the 3B modem. What do you see? Something like --

MODEL: EchoLife HG612
NAME: FTTC VDSL NTE
POWER RATING == 12V, 1A

I've emailed Kelly and asked them for a replacement PSU - let's see what happens.

However I am a software man, know very little about hardware. What is the end result of using the older PSU going to be, other than using less watts

Is it possible to use a different modem than the one Bt openreach supplies? I know someone who is looking at FTTC, and have seen a Billion VDSl all in one for a pretty good price and would prefer to use that than BT open reach Huawei as they don't trust Huawei ( don't blame them to be honest)

Really no problem. Let Openreach come and install their kit. After they have gone, use the 'all in one' stuff. Obviously keeping the Openreach modem, so if there is a problem, you can try that instead.

In reply to a post by Squirrel:

I've emailed Kelly and asked them for a replacement PSU - let's see what happens.

However I am a software man, know very little about hardware. What is the end result of using the older PSU going to be, other than using less watts

It is not a matter of using less watts. The device draws the power/current the PSU does not push it. If the modem needs 1A and the PSU cannot supply it, the modem will not work correctly. Imagine trying to run your TV on a 160v mains when it is rated for 230v.

Before I get flamed, the above is simplified

DrT

In reply to a post by Zarjaz:

Really no problem. Let Openreach come and install their kit. After they have gone, use the 'all in one' stuff. Obviously keeping the Openreach modem, so if there is a problem, you can try that instead.

Just sent him a text to say that it should be ok. Knowing very little about FTTC, will the modem need a username and password like ADSL modems/routers?

Thanks

You would be running the PSU at its design limits, thus may run hotter than usual, be prone to early life failure. It is feasible that the lower rated power supply may be more of a fire risk when running mismatched.

For the modem the result may be that you get memory errors, CPU crashes. Things may be okay under profile 8c, but with 17a using more power the PSU may slow some people down.

In reply to a post by zyborg47:

In reply to a post by Zarjaz:

Just sent him a text to say that it should be ok. Knowing very little about FTTC, will the modem need a username and password like ADSL modems/routers?

In the case of a combined router/VDSL modem, yes.

In reply to a post by zyborg47:

Knowing very little about FTTC, will the modem need a username and password like ADSL modems/routers?

Yes and no. The user and pass for the modem on its own is entered on the PC for the PPPoE connectoid, on ADSL it is entered in the modem itself.

DrT

In my absence, both DrT and MrS have answered your query.

And in my opinion, anyone who has not had the PSU replaced at the same time as the modem should lodge a complaint with Openreach with regards to the failings of Kelly Communications.

Edited by burakkucat (Mon 27-Feb-12 00:19:53)

In reply to a post by DrTeeth:

In reply to a post by zyborg47:

Knowing very little about FTTC, will the modem need a username and password like ADSL modems/routers?

Yes and no. The user and pass for the modem on its own is entered on the PC for the PPPoE connectoid, on ADSL it is entered in the modem itself.

DrT

Confused? if it is entered on the PC then that means the PC needs to be left on or is it still stored on the modem?

The PC does not have to be left on and it is not stored in the modem. The modem with still sync and 'work' without an autentication - the authentication just allows you to pass data and use it...simples.

DrT

In reply to a post by DrTeeth:

The PC does not have to be left on and it is not stored in the modem. The modem with still sync and 'work' without an autentication - the authentication just allows you to pass data and use it...simples.

DrT

Ah, so the user name and password is stored in the router and it is the router that passes that info to the modem, like when we used to have ADSL modems on the USB ports and had to get windows to authenticate.

I know that a ADSL router/modem will sync before any authentication, but will not pass data.

I get it now. so in theory you can just connect a computer to VDSL modem and get the Os to pass the authentication, sort of like we did in USB modem days? Not advisable due to lack of firewall and also not being able to use multiple devices but it can be done.

In reply to a post by zyborg47:

I get it now. so in theory you can just connect a computer to VDSL modem and get the Os to pass the authentication, sort of like we did in USB modem days? Not advisable due to lack of firewall and also not being able to use multiple devices but it can be done.

Absolutely right and set up the same way.

Just got an email back from Kelly Engineering.

"BT have advised us that the power supply does not have to be changed."

DrT

In reply to a post by DrTeeth:

Just got an email back from Kelly Engineering.

"BT have advised us that the power supply does not have to be changed."

I'd fully expect them to say that. I just saw the new PSU sitting in the box next to the modem and thought it would be daft not to ask for it and I suggest that anyone else in that position does the same.

I'll definitely ask for the PSU. Some people have said that the engineers do not carry them. Others say that the engineers are given a boxed modem for the job which includes the PSU and any cables.

I am just trying to establish what my position would be if the engineer refuses to hand over the PSU. I would not mind so much if they were identically specced, but they are not.

DrT

I did some measurements a while back and the "old" PSU is running at under the design capability when on 17c ... and it works fine with the older and newer modems.

There are two possibilities for needing the extra 3.6W (or so):

Firstly, some devices may be at edge of tolerance and consume additional power even on 17c or;

secondly if/when BT go to the 30MHz scheme then it will need additional power.

When I get the chance, I will measure again.

Had mine changed by an Openreach engineer today. No PSU in the box, but when I asked for a replacement he got a spare from the van. Until I mentioned it, he hadn't noticed that the new modem power rating is more than the old PSU can supply. He will inform his mates.

I will, of course, update this thread after the visit. Got an evening slot.

DrT

Chap just visited. The modems do NOT come with a PSU in the same box any more, they used to. The chap seemed to know that the PSU should be replaced and said was picking up a box of 10 from the stores and should be bringing one before Friday.

DrT

Edited by deleted (Mon 27-Feb-12 18:29:27)

In reply to a post by DrTeeth:

The modems do NOT come with a PSU in the same box any more

They did last week!

In reply to a post by kasg:

They did last week!

Spit .

DrT

Our modem was replaced last week and the Kelly engineer said no PSU and cables in the new boxes.
Could be that some boxes have no PSU's for replacements or someone could be taking these out of the boxes prior to comming into the house?
Think someone at BT management needs to say what should have been replaced or not replaced.

Hi All

We�ve checked this for you and can confirm that the PSU does not need to be replaced, both models of PSU are suitable to power the new modem. Initially during the early part of the replacement programme some customers may have received a replacement PSU, but this is not necessary so the PSU is no longer being replaced.

Hope that helps clarify things for you all.

Regards David

In reply to a post by BT_Care:

We�ve checked this for you and can confirm that the PSU does not need to be replaced, both models of PSU are suitable to power the new modem. Initially during the early part of the replacement programme some customers may have received a replacement PSU, but this is not necessary so the PSU is no longer being replaced.

Regards David

I don't think that is right David.

The PSU on the old modem is rated at 0.6A output. The old modem has a peak requirement of 0.7A.

The new PSU is rated at 1A, which is the peak requirement of the new router. I assume PSUs have output ratings for a reason.

I also checked independent of BT Care and same answer

If the PSUs do not need to be replaced, what ARE they being replaced and how come the Kelly engineer could get them? The plot thickens...

DrT

Why the replacements?
Component in the modem itself that was likely to lead to early life failure.

Why PSU in box?
Because at start of programme that is all that was available, i.e. batches of modem only were not available. Newer lots (remember 100,000's to replace) should be modem only.

Utter nonsense!

I shall be discussing the facts with a far higher authority within the BT Group.

I shall be discussing the facts with a far higher authority within the BT Group.

LOL

Lolling should be directed to Huawei as they are paying for this changeout. If they are not changing out PSU's it will be because they are confident of the existing kit.

You know this for a fact?

Sure. Huawei are footing the bill.

You win a multimillion contract to supply kit, you pick up the bill when the kit is deployed with a design fault.

Edited by deleted (Tue 06-Mar-12 21:01:08)

I had mine replaced on Saturday, the old one was 100% fine and i was reluctant to let it go..... he wouldn't let me keep it...

I've not been here for ages, are there or is there any known issues with the newer 3B versions other than this power adaptor thing?

Ta.

Not quite the full story.

Huawei have modified one of their standard modems to Openreach requirements/specifications. If the problem is not evident in their standard product the responsibility would seem to be Openreach's. One has to assume that they performed quality tests on samples, and signed off the product.

As long as the ones in the field conform with the signed-off sample standard then Huawei are in the clear. If they don't, then Openreach are in the clear.

Ah I see, I assume you must be the contract lawyer that drew up the contract between BT and Huawei. I never realised

Perhaps before you continue to make schoolboy silly comments about my posts, which seems to be something you like doing, you should look more closely at the exchange leading up to the post you smart-assedly criticise.

In this case you will see I was merely pointing out that partial has no idea of the contract that was drawn up, and I gave two possibilities. With one of them he would be right, with the other he would be wrong.

By contrast, you are just a PITA.

When did I get you so upset? What did I do to you? It clearly hurt.

Just drop it will you please. You annoy me in the same way as a housefly in the room does - no effect on my life at all. Just an insect causing a distraction to my train of thought.

I don't kill flies these days. I just guide them out. They seem much happier once I save them from banging their heads against the window. You could learn something from houseflies.

Edit - typo.

Edited by RobertoS (Tue 06-Mar-12 23:47:59)

I think if If it was me I would get myself a 1500mA psu and use that.

http://cpc.farnell.com/jsp/level5/module.jsp?moduleI...

There is a 12v 2A one

Edited by deleted (Wed 07-Mar-12 07:21:03)

ThinkBroadband contributor MHC has already performed some useful tests on the Huawei HG612. MHC discovered that the Huawei draws a peak current of 550mA on a 40/10Mbps 17MHz VDSL2 service. [1]

His findings closely correlate with the specs published in the latest release (Feb 2012) of the BT Supplier Info Note (SIN 498 Issue 3.3) [2]

According to British Telecom, the power consumption of the Huawei HG612 ("Type 1 VDSL2 Active NTE") is <6.5W.

6.5W = 540mA @ 12V.

As an aside, the other VDSL2 CPE, the ECI B-FOCuS V-2FUb/I Rev.B ("Type 2 VDSL2 Active NTE") consumes <8.6W.

The EU issued Regulations (EC Regs 1275/2008) on the power consumption of broadband access equipment. The Code of Practice to those Regulations defines target efficiency levels for broadband CPE. Manufacturers are expected to meet those targets.

For our interest - establishing the demands of the PSU of the HG612 - we need to know the full power operational state of the modem, rather than its power consumption in "standby" or "low-power" modes.

The Huawei HG612 is powered by a Broadcom 6368 System-on-Chip (SoC). The 6368 is highly integrated and requires few external components with their own load. The 6368 integrates a dual-MIPS32 core, an analog front end (AFE) and a line driver, and a number of 'chiplet' modules. [3]

The Huawei is based upon the Broadcom 96368MVWG board reference design. Several of the 6368 core modules are not used by the Huawei. These modules include a USB host controller and a SLAC controller for analog voice telephony. The 6368 also supports an external 802.11n transceiver but this is not present on the Huawei. To reduce power consumption, unused modules are disabled by the Huawei at boot-time.

Broadcom has published a White Paper entitled "BCM63XX/BCM68XX Power Management" in satisfaction of those EC regulations [4] Several board reference designs are listed with their power consumptions in various states.

The 96368MVNGR [VDSL2, 4FE, 802.11n (43222), USB] is the closest reference design to the 96368MVWG design used by Huawei for the HG612.

According to Broadcom, the 96368MVNGR consumes 7.3 watts in Full-Power state. However, that figure includes the power consumption of an active 802.11n radio and USB host controller, neither of which are used by the Huawei. 7.3 watts must be well in excess of the maximum power consumption of the Huawei...

7.3W = 610mA @ 12V.

According to those back-of-envelope calculations, the original 700mA rated PSU supplied with the HG612 is quite capable of adequately powering the device safely.

cheers, a

[1] http://forums.thinkbroadband.com/fibre/4098966-power...
[2] http://www.sinet.bt.com/498v3p3a.pdf
[3] http://pdf.eccn.com/pdfs/Datasheets/Broadcom/CM6368.pdf
[4] http://www.broadcom.com/collateral/wp/63XX_68XX-WP10...

Edited by deleted (Wed 07-Mar-12 23:45:42)

Brilliant .

Facts!

I wonder why the bigger PSU is specified for new modems? Might it need more power on 80/20? Were MHC's tests on 8c or 17a?

My tests were on 17MHz profile capped at 40Mbps downstream with comments about increases to 80/20 and further downstream changes to a 30MHz profile.

As Asbokid says, the Broadcom figures correlate with the Huawei consumption but there are some components missing, but it probably does not account for the Ethernet ports.

As I said the old supply would cope - but may be towards it's limit. With too many years of electronics design behind me, I would be considering something a little greater than 700mA - just one of those feelings that comes with experience.

Suit yourself, but as they are not expensive I would go for a larger capacity psu.

Its not a problem I will face, FTTC has not graced these parts yet.

Here's another from satcure at less than a tenner

http://www.satcure.co.uk/accs/page5.htm

Edited by deleted (Wed 07-Mar-12 19:10:43)

In reply to a post by MHC:

just one of those feelings that comes with experience.

Yes, I agree.

A safety margin as narrow as that for a device intended to run continuously and (largely) unattended cannot be considered to be a safe design.

The original 700mA black PSU for the Huawei sells for just 75 pence in China. [1] BT purchased the units in six-figure volumes, and probably paid less than half that. Maybe I'm just stingy but £16 is a lot to charge for a 'wall wart', whatever its rating.

Has anyone examined the construction and performance of switched-mode PSUs? This one (the 700mA rated FM120007-UK) has been heat-sealed and cannot easily be opened for examination.

How noisy are these PSUs? According to Alcatel-Lucent, the switching converters of SM-PSUs are "known to be a common source of EMI for in-house cabling networks that carry DSL signals. The DSL performance can degrade substantially because of such interference" [2]

An interesting project there for an EE student!

cheers, a

[1] http://item.taobao.com/item.htm?id=14687748456
[2] http://www.wipo.int/patentscope/search/docservicepdf...

Edited by deleted (Wed 07-Mar-12 20:09:08)

BT has said no need to swap PSU, and stated PSU is perfectly good for the job. Perhaps time for people to wait and see if there are failures and enjoy suitable gloating time.

In reply to a post by MrSaffron:

BT has said no need to swap PSU, and stated PSU is perfectly good for the job.

They have indeed... what was it they said about reports of overheating modems in the early days?

My Modem was replaced yesterday. Unfortunately wasn't in so wife sorted it. PSU was not changed. New modem looks identical and appears to behave the same. I'll do a full speedtest at a quieter time.

Robert
Basingstoke

In view of what has been said, is it possible that BT are still installing Infinity with Version 1B modems? I looked at the bottom of mine last night and the sticker said Version 1B. It was only installed at the beginning of May

In reply to a post by snapper69:

In view of what has been said, is it possible that BT are still installing Infinity with Version 1B modems? I looked at the bottom of mine last night and the sticker said Version 1B. It was only installed at the beginning of May

It's definitely a Huawei modem because I didn't think the version 1 Huawei's had the version number on them whereas the 2V and 3B versions do.

There's an ECI version 1B modem which is the current ECI model because that's what I had installed a couple of weeks ago which I have since replaced with an unlocked Huawei 3B

It's definitely a Huawei modem ....

The rest of your post implies you have missed out a "not" there?