Cerberus Fibre Order Updates

Created a new post, as the other one was losing focus.

I will post updates here:

Order has been placed.
Paid initial setup fee on credit card
This is a business package, so all prices are ex VAT.

Cerberus does have a AUP, but it DOES NOT state any limits. Just that they will warn you when they believe you are being excessive. I stated, my max download amount was 4TB in a given month, and was told that's fine, considering if you really hammered a 330mb line you could download 100TB, so 4TB is around 4% of possible total download.

Edited by Snake (Fri 08-Sep-17 14:59:26)

I don't like the sound of AUP. They can change it whatever they like. They might say it ok for u to downloading 4TB no problem. But later on they might warned you do not excessive 750GB only time will tell. If they lied to u, can you get out of it? I doubt it.

All ISP's will have some sort of AUP. Please don't reply to this thread use the other thread. You are just making unwanted noise and causing confusion.

This is a free forum to anyone to post or reply. There is nothing stopped me or prevent me of posting here. So u can't tell me what to do. Only MrSaffron can.

As much as you have a point, Max, I think for Snake to kindly ask you to use the other thread, isn't worth complaining over.

I'm not saying you can't post. All I said was that I wanted this thread to be about updates and not debates over what you or I think is right.

I don't work for Cerberus, and if your not happy with AUP or any other policy that's fine. No one is forcing you to sign up. I just want post updates about the install here. So please if you want to discuss more about policies, contracts etc... use the other thread, so people can get updates here without having to go through an entire thread.

Ok, good luck. I look forward to see updated post from your Cerberus FTTPoD installation and updated from Openreach survey.

Just a quick update for anyone following:

I have been out of the country and so haven't really been chasing Cerberus. However they did try to call me and leave messages. They also followed up via email to let me know they are waiting on Openreach to schedule and survey. Openreach seem to be very busy, but they hope to have a date soon.

Update: 20/09/2017

Yesterday Cerberus informed me that Openreach will be doing an external survey to figure out how to get the Fibre service to my premises. Since their is no existing network (FTTP) in place. This should be done by the end of this week with an update provided on 25th of September.

The surveyor may ask to see the inside of the property, however the internal survey could be a separate survey depending on how much work they believe they have to externally. So in the event the external work is going to cost a lot they may just go back with an update stating excess charges and only do internal survey once they know the customer is going ahead and happy with the excess charges.

If you already have ductwork in place to your property, then I would be surprised if there are ECCs involved.

You stated in the other thread that you're in Band B (200-399m from the agg node), so you should be well within the £1,350 threshold before ECCs come into play.

I be very surprise if Openreach survey gonna cost u a bomb bill of more than £2,000 to cancel the order. Your probably end up Band C or D instead of B.

Edited by adslmax (Wed 20-Sep-17 22:32:37)

I think that�s what they are going to confirm. The aggregation node is close, however duct work etc... needs to be confirmed. I have a pole right outside my house, so I am guessing that�s probably the path it will take.

You don�t pay the £2400 (inc VAT) if the survey has excess charges.

so u took first order from cerberus 8th September, openreach doing survey on the 25th September. Look like they speedy it up with your order to get FTTPoD activation date around December before xmas day!

The default time is 60/90 days to install, so yeah it could be December, but I was told this by them up front. They said the fastest they think it could be done is 60 days, but it all comes down to the survey.

Wish u all the best of luck. Remember post back each photos of the work by openreach, modem, router and post back speedtest (morning, afternoon and evening.

Same here, actively following as I'm tempted by Cerberus's FTTP on demand offer, I believe there's ducting under my house as there was a piece of string there ready for Openreach to install the cable when we moved in around 6 years ago, waiting to see how it goes on here before ordering myself.

How can you tell there is ducting there? I got a footpath label BT under it just a few step out of my house. Can Openreach installing there?

Because they can't pull cable through the ground with string. There must be ducting if they were pulling cables with string.
Sounds like a new property.

This the one footpath label BT just outside of my house. Please note: this is not a picture of mine, just example one

https://www.thinkbroadband.com/images/news/7389-open...

The duct comes out of the ground and the copper goes down it, it's a fairly new property.

Spoke to cerberus today myself, AUP / Fair usage policy doesn't have a cap, as in no GB / TB limits and their low prices is due to being the first to have a new deal with Openreach which also doesn't charge traffic usage unlike the older £300 deal, other companies may end up having the same lower priced deal later on. Can use your own router with their FTTP on demand as well.

In reply to a post by gigaplant:

Spoke to cerberus today myself, AUP / Fair usage policy doesn't have a cap, as in no GB / TB limits and their low prices is due to being the first to have a new deal with Openreach which also doesn't charge traffic usage unlike the older £300 deal, other companies may end up having the same lower priced deal later on. Can use your own router with their FTTP on demand as well.

This is complete nonsense.

Firstly, Openreach purely provides the connection from the end user's premises to the local handover exchange, there is no charge for data with Openreach.

Secondly, Openreach does not offer special 'deals' to new individual CPs. They are legally not allowed to do this as it would breach their equivalence covenant.

There seems to be a disconnect between the Sales team and underlying reality. I would guess they are using backhaul from some LLU operator rather than BT wholesale.

Can we keep this thread for updates of install only please

Happy for this discussion to continue on the other thread.

I placed an order with Cerberus on 5 September. The latest update I have is that OR are waiting to schedule a surveyor to do the survey. The good news is that have processed my order.

I haven't been given a survey date yet. I live in London so I guess it will depend on the availability of surveyors in my area.

I am in Band E so they are going to have a long run of cable to install. I'm hoping there are no complications with getting fibre to the tel phone pole that is right by my driveway. I will then need to speak to them about how I get the fibre to my house either under my drive way or in the air like my copper line is currently.

I'll post my updates in this forum for you guys.

Edited by deleted (Thu 21-Sep-17 23:43:33)

lol

In reply to a post by mumba:

The latest update I have is that OR are waiting to schedule a surveyor to do the survey.
...snip...
I am in Band E so they are going to have a long run of cable

Not sure how this all works but how do you know you are in Band E if the survey hasn't yet been done?

Bands are based on distance to node. Standard pricing based on distance and then if there are "excess costs" (shown in the survey) then these would be in addition to the banded install costs.

As mentioned above when you place your order they calculate what band you are in from your phone number and the estimated distance your current line is from the node.

Update: 26th September 2017

Got a Openreach Surveyor, he will now be visiting my property tomorrow. I am guessing the external Survey was done, so now they just want to confirm any internal issues etc...

Will update after the surveyor leaves tomorrow.

Thats good. Thanks for updated

you are lucky. I am still waiting for any type of survey.

I'm beginning to think OR are giving you preferential treatment.

Lol I wish. I just called Cerberus yesterday to get update as they told me to call them on Monday, and today I got call from Openreach.

It might be because I am closer to aggregation point, but I don�t know. I will ask the surveyor tomorrow and see what he says.

Update: 27/09/2017

So the Openreach Surveyor just left. All is good, except the pole outside my house will need to be replaced. The surveyor said that would not incur any excess charges as BT would be replacing it anyway. They will hopefully speed up the replacement as it is now required part of the installation. Might add a week or two to the install.

Did you ask the surveyor how they choose the priority of their surveys in London?

I'm still waiting for my call from OR to schedule mine.



Great news though on your progress so far. I'm hoping I will be as lucky.

I did ask, he said there isn�t a pretence it�s just as surveyors become available. I would keep pestering Cerberus to make sure they are on Openreach to get someone out

Did Openreach Surveyor tell u which band are u on?

Band B - same as everyone been saying. He did say my install should be super easy, barring the pole needing replacement.

Do u think I am possibly in Band B not Band F? Because my property run copper wiring under the ground. Outside of my front garden footway there is a label of BT on it, probably aggregation node a further up by the cabinet.

Edited by adslmax (Wed 27-Sep-17 21:17:20)

I wouldn�t know, you might able to find out If you call Fluidone or Cerberus.

Your nearest aggregating node will serve a number of local cabinets. Chances are the Agg Node is further than the cabinet.

The fact you have a BT chamber on the footpath outside your house doesn't mean the Agg Node is any closer. It's just because your line runs underground, and chambers are dotted along the length of of your line.

Who told you that you were band F?

cerberus told me I am on band F

Then you're band F.
It wouldn't make good business sense to tell a potential customer their installation bill is going to be thousands of £ more than it should be.

That's why it put me off. I wait until g.fast come to my cabinet next summer.

Update 28 September:

Hi All,

I have an exciting update. A very nice and friendly OR surveyor called me this morning to let me know that he is scheduled to do a survey at my house tomorrow.

I have arranged to be at home to take him through all the details of where I want the line to enter my house etc.

I will let you all know how it goes and what issues etc. he raises.

At least I am beginning to feel some real momentum here. My install is probably going to be a lot more complex than Snake's as I am in Band E.

Sounds great, I hope the install process goes smoothly!

In reply to a post by mumba:

My install is probably going to be a lot more complex than Snake's as I am in Band E.

Not necessarily. Mine was band D (~ 800m to agg node) yet I had the service installed in just over 3 months without any dramas. If they run your fibre in u/g ducts all the way to agg node then potentially the biggest hurdle is blocked ducts which can cause delays, especially if the ducts need to be dug up to remove the blockages.

Yeah agreed.

I'm just worried that the longer the run of fibre needs to be the higher the chance that something gets physically in the way that can cause delays.

Well for me it seems the telephone/telegraph pole is the issue, I am assuming they will run the fibre at the same as the pole change then have a fibre manifold on the pole. After the engineer will do the final run to the house.

I am hoping I can get it all sorted by the end of October, although that might be pushing it, however I definitely think it should be all completed before the end of November

It is highly unlikely that the pole erection team will be doing the manifold at the same time.

I was hoping the pole team and the fibre team with corordinate the work to reduce the disruption etc...

Update 29 September:

Hi All,

So the OR surveyor arrived this morning 10 mins before our scheduled appointment. A really nice and friendly man.

Anyway he was more of an expert on the external running of the fibre but I showed him the internal location of where I want the fibre to terminate in my existing cupboard in the garage.

He said that he doesn't see any problems running the fibre to the side of my house and in through the external wall by my garage. They are basically going to run the fibre from the pole suspended in the air like my existing copper cable, and then run the fibre along my roof drains and pipes to hide it. I was worried that fibre can't bend etc but he said it's no problem for my run. So no digging up driveways or anything for me.

Also what's interesting is he said he'll recommend they replace my existing copper cable with a new dual cable that has both fibre and copper so that there is only one cable hanging above my driveway rather than 2.

As I mentioned he wasn't that knowledgeable on the internal equipment and internal socket.

I want to replace my existing FTTC openreach modem with the Fibre ONT one and also place the fibre socket next to the existing BT copper socket. However I don't know what the dimensions of the ONT and fibre socket are.

Do any of you know?

Also do you guys know if you can cancel your line rental for the existing copper line once you get the fibre line i.e. will BT treat them as one line?

Lastly I asked the surveyor what sort of times they are experiencing from survey to final installation and he said around 3 months.

Obviously that is dependant on physical issues like blocked ducts or needing to close roads etc. He told me he doesn't think there is any major issue with running the fibre to my tel pole but he would let me know if he discovers one.

Will keep you all updated.

Based on my measurements, dimensions of my 4 port ONT are 20cm x 15cm (length x height)

http://postimg.org/image/5iuymdvpx/

http://postimg.org/image/5wwalzfth/

The copper line remains totally independent of your FTTP line. I'm getting a second (backup) VOIP landline through Sipgate and test this out for a few months for reliability & voice quality. If its as good as my copper TalkTalk line then i will cancel the copper and go VOIP only for voice.

Plenty of info in here https://www.ournetwork.openreach.co.uk/resources/sit...

thanks for all the info guys.

baby_frogmella from your photos it doesn't look like you have a BBU. Did OR not mandate that you needed one?

It's nonsensical that they do because voice is being provided over the fibre but apparently in their rules they have to install a BBU. Maybe in practice they don't bother with a BBU for FTTPoD.

I've been reading the thread with interest.

Did fttp show on the dsl checker that it was available to you? Or did you decide to look around for a company that would bring fttp to your house?

Either way I'm glad your install is going well

FVA is not supported with FoD at the moment.

The BBU comes with all FTTP/FoD installations, even though it only work with FVA in the event of a power outage.

In reply to a post by mumba:

Also do you guys know if you can cancel your line rental for the existing copper line once you get the fibre line i.e. will BT treat them as one line?

FoD is completely independent of an existing copper service, so you can get rid of your copper line and set up some form of VoIP if you wish.

Openreach bod did offer to install the BBU, however I politely declined as I wanted a tidier install. I didn�t see the point of getting it installed as I can�t use any FVA service for 3 years at least. However you may be (un)lucky and get the newer ONT which has a BBU built-in...it�s bigger though! The newer versions are due to installed from October onwards.

what is BBU?

battery backup unit

Thanks

This thread is about FTTP On Demand installation which shows up as 'available' to most people on the BT checker - provided they can already get a FTTC service. At present its just Cerberus and Fluidone selling the service, though another isp called Distant Voice will also be selling the service soon.

I hope I don't get this newer bigger ONT as I want it to fit neatly in my comms cabinet and just replace my current FTTC modem.

The engineer called me back just now saying he had finished his external survey and hadn't found any major issues.

I think I now need to wait until Tuesday for official confirmation that there are no extra construction charges so that I can proceed with the order.

The installer won�t/shouldn�t fit the ONTE in your comms cabinet, it should be wall mounted, keeping the fibre solid in its position.

From the ONTE it�s a standard ethernet cable to the router - so house that in your cabinet instead.

Thanks Zarjaz that's very useful information about it needing to be wall mounted.

My current FTTC modem is mounted to my cisco switch using very strong velcro but I assume that's not going to be good enough for the ONT.

Update 11 October 2017:

Hi All,

So I've had an exciting update today. OR have confirmed with Cerberus that there are no additional charges for my installation.

They have also provided Cerberus with an estimated delivery date of 14 November. If there are no issues then this date can be achieved and if it is I will be super impressed.

So now I just have to wait and hope there are no issues during the installation like blocked ducts etc.

If the 14 November date is achieved then the total turn around time will be 2 months and 9 days.

Good news there Mumba

I shall draw mystic tunes with my cleaver to assuage the fibre Gods for you

I am going to placed an order FTTPoD with Cerberus next week and give it a go. I know I am on Band F but maybe Openreach might surprise me after survey with no addition charge.

Hopefully I should get FTTPoD 330/30 before xmas day!

Edited by adslmax (Thu 12-Oct-17 16:10:21)

Update 13/10/2017

Just been told install date of 16th November. As long as there are no issues with pole replacement etc...

There are no ECC charges.

total turn around time will be ? months and ? days?

2 months 8 days or so. Under the estimated 90 days, so I am impressed so far

That's pretty great. Can't wait to placed an order on Monday with Cerberus. Hopefully mine will be ready just in time before xmas day.

Very surprised your ordering after all the FUP and AUP discussion and also how you were treated before? Also if you really are Band F it�s going to be double / triple my installation cost upfront.

Don't think it will be band f. Cerberus confident it won't be in band f. They told me don't worry about FUP or AUP. It's will be totally UNLIMITED USAGE under FTTPoD.

The estimated lead time to activation is 90 days for variable connection charge bands A-E. The estimated lead time for variable connection charge bands F-K is not defined.

Edited by adslmax (Sat 14-Oct-17 01:30:14)

My order had been placed and paid by set up fee on my credit card.

In reply to a post by adslmax:

My order had been placed and paid by set up fee on my credit card.

Nice one, hope you get it installed without any dramas. Did you have to pay the setup fees (band F?) in advance?

Oh dear! Why oh why did you do that?

Well you finally bit the bullet - I hope you see it through to the end!

Question: Do you think 330Mb/s will be fast enough?

Snake it's going to be interesting to see who gets theirs first you or me.

Both our estimated dates are mid November. Also the estimated date is for the external connection they still need to co-ordinate another team for the internal connection which I am hoping will be scheduled the same day or the next.

Let's hope we both are up and running before the end of November.

My biggest concern is the pole replacement. Otherwise I�d think I would have had it sooner

I�ll be happy if I can get it on or close to that date. I am away on holiday and won�t be back until the end of the month so only two weeks to go when I get back

I had a pole replacement on my order, that part went reasonably smoothly (2-3 weeks to sort out). What's really poleaxed me was the revelation that there's an FTTP card needed at the head end exchange which is a 6 month wait!

Fingers crossed you won't get any nasty surprises like that.

I don�t think I will, since I am very close to Ilford where thy have rolled out fibre etc... so they could borrow a card if needed. They also did do some work in ensuring they knew what was needed etc... but this could be all wishful thinking

If you're in a more populated area, I think you're right it'll be ok from that perspective (I'm fairly rural, and have a feeling I'm the first FTTP order in the area).

That said it definitely wasn't picked up before the order was placed as I'd been given an expected completion date of Dec 2017 intially and a load of work (e.g. pole replacement) was done before the availability check on the head end was completed and suddenly shot my completion date out to sometime Q1 2018

Rasene please tell me you used the word "poleaxed" on purpose.

Well if i hadn't I'm definitely going to pretend I did!

In reply to a post by mumba:

Let's hope we both are up and running before the end of November.

Or let hope three of us are up and running before the end of November. I have to wait for Openreach to do survey on the 30th October. Already paid setup fee on credit card. Hope my band isn't F or G.

Cerberus gave me a special SMS service for hard of hearing who unable to hear engineer call when doing the survey as the engineer will text me instead of calling me. That's a good start. They put disability as top priority between the customer, isp and openreach during this stage phase.

Plusnet couldn't do this way!

Edited by adslmax (Tue 17-Oct-17 17:05:03)

In reply to a post by witchunt:

Oh dear! Why oh why did you do that?

Because I want it. I got the money!

In reply to a post by Rastus:

Well you finally bit the bullet - I hope you see it through to the end!

Question: Do you think 330Mb/s will be fast enough?

Well for now 330/30 is more than enough then after 36 months, might change to FTTP 500/50 if all possible.

In reply to a post by baby_frogmella:

Nice one, hope you get it installed without any dramas. Did you have to pay the setup fees (band F?) in advance?

Thanks, no I just pay the setup fee by CC. After survey done, if no further cost and will go ahead, but if it was extra cost of Band F or G then will let me know so I can decide to go ahead or not. And will refund the setup fee back to my CC if not go ahead. But Cerberus hope it won't be the case and believe I shouldn't be in Band F or G.

Edited by adslmax (Tue 17-Oct-17 17:13:46)

Will it affect my phone line or my current fibre with plusnet when survey come out?

Edited by adslmax (Tue 17-Oct-17 17:15:12)

In reply to a post by adslmax:

Will it affect my phone line or my current fibre with plusnet when survey come out?

Nothing happens to your existing copper line and any voice/data services on it remain untouched.

Thanks, if FTTPoD go ahead then I will cancel it with Plusnet but I just wait until the service went LIVE first. Do u think I will get FTTPoD go live before xmas day as I know openreach is very busy during December before break up for holiday.

Who is your account/sales manager? Mine is Martin, he has been a top bloke, between him and the rest of the team at Cerberus I am very happy with the service provided

Snap! Martin is my Sales manager and yes he is very helpful and was awareness of my disability too. Far miles better than Plusnet.

Edited by adslmax (Tue 17-Oct-17 17:42:18)

Can't wait for g.fast?

Oh great to hear.

In reply to a post by witchunt:

Can't wait for g.fast?

FTTPoD is far better than g.fast as g.fast is very limit depend how far away from the cabinet. I wouldn't get full 330/50 on g.fast. FTTPoD is guarantee 330/30 no matter how far away from the telephone exchange.

section 75 protection, sound move.

No such thing, it's business not consumer.

Throughput is not guaranteed. It's a shared service on the backhaul.

You will get G.fast before FoD - that much I can say.

In reply to a post by AndyHCZ:

Throughput is not guaranteed. It's a shared service on the backhaul.

True, FoD is contended but in the 4 months or so I�ve had the service I�ve not had any slowdowns. 310/30 Mbps throughput day & night

To clarify some information for readers of this thread - the only upfront charge that Cerberus makes is for the installation band a property resides in. This means:

We input your information and we retrieve your Variable Cost Band (VCB) immediately
We make you aware of the cost of that band immediately
We provide you with a formal quotation with the stated band and stated cost combined
Payment by the customer is then made on this basis before any engineer is sent to site

There is no separate installation cost to pay where we then send an engineer to find out what band a property is in. This is known upfront, made clear and is known by Openreach engineers attending site from the get-go.

I'm very happy to see some of our clients in here, and finding positive experiences all round - we appreciate the feedback on an independent forum.

In reply to a post by AndyHCZ:

You will get G.fast before FoD - that much I can say.

I heard my area won't be ready until next summer or autumn 2018. It won't be ready before xmas for my area. FTTPoD will be.

In reply to a post by adslmax:

In reply to a post by AndyHCZ:

You will get G.fast before FoD - that much I can say.

I heard my area won't be ready until next summer or autumn 2018. It won't be ready before xmas for my area. FTTPoD will be.

Don't forget that G.Fast is an 'up to' service (rate adaptive) so you'll always be trying to squeeze every bit of juice from your line (assuming you don't sync at the max 330/50). You'll constantly be wondering

Am i connected to the right type/make of G-Fast Pod?
Am i using the right type of G.Fast modem?
and potentially worst of all: will the dreaded DLM ever remove my banding?

On FTTP no such worries. You'll get a brand spanking new fibre optic cable installed all the way from the agg node to your living room and your ONT will ALWAYS "sync" at the speed you're paying for. None of this 'up to' rubbish or DLM to worry about. Reboot your ONT as often as you like Of course FTTP is not immune from congestion but this is potentially the only possible problem you're likely to face on FTTP wrt speed issues. Not that i've experienced any speed issues on FTTP (touch wood)

I agree as FTTP/FTTPoD are the future NOW! G.Fast is just like another upgrade from ADSLMAX (8Mbps) to ADSL2+ (21Mbps) and for VDSL to G.FAST (76Mbps to varies up to 330Mbps) but I knew g.fast will get 330 for approx 5% of it (must be within 50m or less)

FTTP or FTTPoD no worry at all. And goodbye to DLM.

Edited by adslmax (Wed 18-Oct-17 13:08:51)

To be honest if you are potentially in Band F for FTTPoD then G.Fast isn't going to do a lot for you in the current rollout no matter when it lands.

Why ?

FTTPoD bands are from the aggregation node to the property, nothing to do with the PCP.

Have either Cerberus or Fluidone offered to give you 330/50 when it is available? I thought this band was due to become available in October.... which is roughly now!

Hi Bill100

I haven't been offered 330/50. Where did you hear that FTTPoD was being offered at 330/50 from October?

In reply to a post by adslmax:

Snap! Martin is my Sales manager and yes he is very helpful and was awareness of my disability too. Far miles better than Plusnet.

Mine is Vruti. She and her team are amazingly helpful and efficient at keeping me up to date with the progress of my order and my detailed questions.

They really do seem to care about customer service and realise how excited we early adopters are to unwrap our shiny new fibre lines as soon as possible.

I guess it depends on where the agg node is in comparison to the cabinet. The cab could be a lot closer than the agg node but it could also be further away.

Update: 19/10/2017

BT engineers on my street rolling out the fiber to the pole - I asked about the pole replacement, but they said they don't do that bit. The good news is that they have run the fiber up to my street corner without any issues. Last run from end of the street to my pole.

Here are some images:

https://gyazo.com/fa99d12a7617882291b94e5db1b7ed7c

https://gyazo.com/38340320216348dc052d794981080377

https://gyazo.com/0c862aa6ba992d6b1aee5e5d054f6992


Nothing to see really, but its all happening now

PS: Mumba - I am also working with Vruti she has been awesome. Martin was from sales, but still calls me to make sure things are going smoothly. Awesome service so far.

Just for info - it�s �fibre�

Sounds like your service is edging nearer

I work with a lot of American companies so bad habit of fiber yes uk english it's fibre

So they told you that you are on band f. How much did they charge for installation

They are up to the pole now

Just been told, Openreach looking to replace the pole asap, fingers crossed will have a date for that soon. I like the fact the fibre run be done and so the pole guys can do their work and the fibre will be in place already

https://gyazo.com/24c31cb6e392ae5f6b00a627f91969bf

Bad news

The fibre reached 20 meters to the pole, but the duct work is blocked. So they have put in for duct work replacement .

I am guessing this is independent from the pole and so just comes down to when that can be done.

In reply to a post by Snake:

Bad news

The fibre reached 20 meters to the pole, but the duct work is blocked. So they have put in for duct work replacement .

I am guessing this is independent from the pole and so just comes down to when that can be done.

Snake you are so lucky that you are seeing physical progress already. It's not cool that you have this blocked duct issue but still they are working on it at least.

OR have told Cerberus that for my job they need to allocate night workers as day work will delay things due to traffic management etc.

So now I am at the mercy of OR actually making night resources available for my job.

I honestly wasn't expecting anyone from OR today - I saw three vans and thought just maybe it might be them, but didn't want to get too excited. Then I got a call from Cerberus to confirm engineers onsite today and possibly tomorrow. However they managed to get very far, shame the last 20m or so had to be blocked

Oh well now I have to wait for someone to dig up the pavement and fix the blockage, also need to wait on pole replacement, then fibre run.

The good news is, I am still just under a month away from the install date, and I think they gave a date based on things like blocked ducts coming up. Don't want to be over confident, but maybe just maybe they will still hit that date.

Does that mean you�ll end up with ECCs?

In reply to a post by gigaplant:

Does that mean you�ll end up with ECCs?

OR are responsible for any issues with their own infrastructure like blocked ducts or poles.

Also once the survey has confirmed no ECC's I don't think they can add any afterwards.

In reply to a post by gigaplant:

Does that mean you�ll end up with ECCs?

I doubt it. Excess Construction Charges (ECCs), if applicable, are normally flagged up at the survey stage, if no ECCs apply then unforeseen work later on such as clearing blocked ducts shouldn't be charged for.

OP, I would take the estimated go live date with a pinch of salt - its not set in stone. Its just an estimate, mine was initially estimated to be in May 2017 but went live in early June. For me the most frustrating part was waiting for the FTTP line testing to be completed & for BT/OR dsl checker to update to 'native' FTTP - this took 3-4 weeks after the physical work was completed. But you'll get there in the end

No, these are covered by Openreach

Update 20/10/2017

I got a card through the post today from Carillion. This contracted by Openreach to change the pole. The bad news is the proposed dates for doing the work

23/10/2017 to 23/03/2018 (5 Months). They do say in the card this is mainly because of planning permission, permits etc..

Ive let Cerberus know - lets see what happens.

If your area is covered by Roadworks.org it will show up on there when a permit is issued, make sure you change the date option from the default which is today.You can even get it to send you an email.

ill keep an eye on the site, but I am away for a week so fingers crossed when I get back the OR elves would have changed the pole

In reply to a post by Snake:

ill keep an eye on the site, but I am away for a week so fingers crossed when I get back the OR elves would have changed the pole

I need the Elves to have night vision goggles in my case.

Sorry to hear the bad news. Hope it will get quickly resolved asap.

Should be ok - I am away on holiday and I got a call from Cerberus to confirm they are chasing Openreach to get a confirmed date for the Pole. Still hoping for a completed install for the 16th of November

Edited by Snake (Wed 25-Oct-17 19:51:35)

Update: 26/10/2017

I went to roadworks.org to see if anything was there and noticed that two BT/OR permits have been approved

So my pole and the duct work will be happening between 30th Oct and 1st Nov . Cerberus have also confirmed OR have confirmed that the works should be going ahead on this date, they are also trying to have everything now completed for the 14th of November.

So far excellent communication and progress considering the issues that have come up

Have you had your survey done yet Max?

No, not yet. Will let you know when it all done. Expecting next week

Updated. Cerberus just emailed me say Openreach survey will be on Monday 9th November (morning slot) slightly delay.

Re-edited: Thursday (not Monday)

Edited by adslmax (Fri 27-Oct-17 13:21:50)

At least its been confirmed...just a week or two to wait

Does the survey come to my house or not? What are they doing on the day?

In reply to a post by adslmax:

Does the survey come to my house or not? What are they doing on the day?

Yes, the OR Surveyor will come into your house briefly to determine the cable routing from the entry point to the ONT location - you can request the ONT to be installed whereever you want it. He will take some photos internally and then spend most of the time outside tracing the route back to the agg node. Offer him plenty of tea and biscuits

Cheers. I will get a tea or coffee plus a cake ready for OR Survey. Thanks. I would like to have it in the back garden rather than the front garden but my master socket coming from underground the pathway at the front garden at the front hallway. The fibre cabinet approx 243m away from my house.

Edited by adslmax (Fri 27-Oct-17 12:51:24)

9th November is a Thursday!

Yes and what about it? Oh sorry my mistake it actually Thursday not Monday. I have now re-edited.

Edited by adslmax (Fri 27-Oct-17 13:20:57)

You said Monday 9th Monday...

Yes I know. Got the day wrong! I have now changed to Thursday in my dairy book. Thanks for the warning.

In reply to a post by adslmax:

Yes I know. Got the day wrong! I have now changed to Thursday in my dairy book. Thanks for the warning.

You're welcome mate, I'm in the process of changing my gas and electricity supplier so knew that either the day was wrong or the date was wrong. You don't want to miss that appointment!

I thought you lived in a flat Max?

In reply to a post by baby_frogmella:

Yes, the OR Surveyor will come into your house briefly to determine the cable routing from the entry point to the ONT location - you can request the ONT to be installed whereever you want it.

In reply to a post by adslmax:

Thanks. I would like to have it in the back garden rather than the front garden but my master socket coming from underground the pathway at the front garden at the front hallway. The fibre cabinet approx 243m away from my house.

Back garden probably not an option for the ONT unless you mean in your shed.

Back of the house might be an option for the CSP though, depending on cable routing possibilities.

You thought it wrong. I always lived in a house with two gardens and a garage.

Likely to carry cost implications if that was ever to actually happen

Do you mean extra charge cost? If I want it in the back garden

In reply to a post by baby_frogmella:

At least its been confirmed...just a week or two to wait

Cerberus Networks has not placed an order for this Forum user - adslmax.

We have not organised this survey, and we have not taken payment from this individual. The user has previously named his account manager earlier in this thread. That account manager is not dealing with this individual. It is also untrue that we have organised for a hard of hearing service, as kind as this report is.

As nice as some of these comments are, it would be disingenuous for us to watch this progress further without addressing it. Please disregard information from this user.

Comments from other users are correct, and we thank you for your feedback on your experiences so far.

I think this was fairly obvious, but thanks for confirming.

Max - time for another break from the forum I would think.

I taking a long break year off. Please accepted my full apology as I was so wrong in this of making things up. Apology to Cerberus, MrSaffron and forum members. I am illness. I taking a year off. No more posting for me.

Good luck to those on FTTPoD with cerberus. Wish them the best of luck.

Edited by adslmax (Fri 27-Oct-17 15:19:54)

Apology. I am so illness mental health problem and often jealous. I shouldn't make it up. A year break would do me good.

Oh my, how embarrassing. I must say I agree with Cerberus posting this as it could really damage their credibility in the long term. Max has made many many claims regarding his communication with them.

In reply to a post by AndyHCZ:

I think this was fairly obvious, but thanks for confirming.

Max - time for another break from the forum I would think.

I agree.

In reply to a post by adslmax:

I taking a long break a year off. Bye!

I highly recommend you do. If you are suffering from depression/other mental health related issues, I recommend visiting your local GP and discussing your problems. From experience I can say there are many great services out there.

Good luck with your break Max.

Edited by j0hn83 (Fri 27-Oct-17 15:26:11)

Thanks for posting this.

Hopefully this thread can now go back to normal.

I will be posting up pics as soon as I see the engineers on the road.

Just goes to show how hideously overpriced lousy FTTPoD actually is, that the only way most people can really afford it and get it - is by dreaming about it.

Shame on Cerberus for not dealing with the whole issue via PM, surely a breach of data protection right there.

Edited by deleted (Fri 27-Oct-17 21:14:08)

Quite right for them to publicly state they are not dealing with any such order when someone has gone out of their way to lie, for whatever reason. No personal information has been given as they presumably don't have any, so no data protection issue.

Did you not see the post ......

http://forums.thinkbroadband.com/fibre/t/4570381-re-...

100% agree.

In reply to a post by Zarjaz:

Did you not see the post ......

http://forums.thinkbroadband.com/fibre/t/4570381-re-...

Yeah seen it but Cerberus posted the above after I had asked Max. I genuinely believed he placed an order

Edited by deleted (Sat 28-Oct-17 08:23:10)

There is no data protectiuon issue, SO LONG AS thinkbroadband didn't supply personal and private information to cerberus linking the adslmax username to his real name/details - without his explicit permission.

Why would adslmax give TBB his real name/details?

No problem -

I believe the Cerberus rep did the right thing, doubtless Max�s fibs might have cast them in a poor light business-wise.

Good of Max to own up too.

In reply to a post by Zarjaz:

Good of Max to own up too.

Did he jump or was he pushed? Clearly the latter.

I wonder how far he'd have continued with his fantasy?

Just to confirm, I told Cerberus up front when placing the order that I am snake from the TBB forum. I wanted them to know because, I would be posting on TBB everything that would be happening with my order. They were OK with me doing that.

In reply to a post by Snake:

Just to confirm, I told Cerberus up front when placing the order that I am snake from the TBB forum. I wanted them to know because, I would be posting on TBB everything that would be happening with my order. They were OK with me doing that.

I don't think you should need to ask for permission when posting about a genuine service installation experience from any ISP. I certainly didn't ask FluidOne if I could post about my FTTPoD installation experience with them. In any case, its free publicity for the ISP so you're doing them a favour, not the other way around.

However if a poster starts telling stories about fictitious orders (as adslmax has done) then of course an ISP has every right to step in and refute these.

It wasn't about asking for permission, it was just notifying them as a courtesy. It wasn't hard for them to work out it was me anyway, based on my phone call's and the messages being posted who i was

In reply to a post by Snake:

It wasn't about asking for permission, it was just notifying them as a courtesy. It wasn't hard for them to work out it was me anyway, based on my phone call's and the messages being posted who i was

Well, that and the details in your profile

LOL

Update 30 October 2017:

Hi All,

I've have another promising update. OR have informed Cerberus that they started their night cabling work on Thursday 26 October.

Cerberus are still waiting on more information from OR which they should get by Wednesday on how they are progressing with this work.

So at least some physical work seems to be taking place and my order is getting real momentum with OR.

I'll update you all shortly, with hopefully good news and not OR excuses about night resources or blocked ducts etc.

Do any of you have any tips of what signs of physical work I can go try and find on my street to assess progress? I know they are running the cable from a cabinet 1km away from my house so I will have to go hunt for it. Might be a great excuse to go for a run.

Why would OR give excuses about night resources or blocked ducts? It's in their interest to provide a service to you as soon as possible as they will only earn from your line when it's active and running.

In reply to a post by AndyHCZ:

Why would OR give excuses about night resources or blocked ducts? It's in their interest to provide a service to you as soon as possible as they will only earn from your line when it's active and running.

I didn't mean it in a way that implies that OR would do it on purpose just they are a big company and need to manage their night resources. Also about the ducts it's more a dig (excuse the pun) that I will be unlucky and there will be blocked ducts between my house and the cabinet /agg node.

On a serious note OR do seem to be providing as good a service as possible to lay the line as fast as possible. They just have a lot of logistics to deal with and old infrastructure.

New prices announced today for FTTPoD:

https://www.openreach.co.uk/orpg/home/products/prici...

Surely this a BIG BLOW for those who recently ordered with Cerberus and FluidOne with all these ridiculously overpriced from Openreach pricing. Feel sorry for them now.

Edited by adslmax (Tue 31-Oct-17 13:19:27)

I think you should edit that Max . To make it clear the high price is due to Openreach charges, not either of the companies you cite.

Done

Update 31 October 2017

Hi All,

I've had another update today from Cerberus. This time not the best news. So of course as my luck would have it OR have found blockages in their ducts during their work.

So now this means I am going to experience a delay but I have no idea how long. I should get an update in the next couple of days hopefully.

Regarding this new pricing it does feel like a kick in the teeth from OR to those of us that have orders in progress or recently had FttpOd installed.

They have been very vague with how the new installation costs will work but I assume it will be less than the installation costs on the current pricing.

Also it seems the monthly rental will be £60 less that they charge the ISP's. The most significant change seems to be that the contract only has to be 12 months. That's probably the biggest kick in the teeth.

In reply to a post by mumba:

They have been very vague with how the new installation costs will work but I assume it will be less than the installation costs on the current pricing.

For a single installation, no-one can say for certain until they've got new quotes and compared them to the old quotes.

In reply to a post by mumba:

The most significant change seems to be that the contract only has to be 12 months. That's probably the biggest kick in the teeth.

Agreed, though if we could predict the future I'm sure we'd all have 10 Gbps private leased lines funded by our lottery wins instead of FTTPoD

Edited by deleted (Tue 31-Oct-17 16:43:31)

Agreed predicting the future would be a handy skill.



Baby_Frogmella do you have any idea how long blocked ducts delay things normally?

Can be tomorrow, can be weeks.

It depends on where the blockage is, how big the blockage is, whether it requires external contractors to dig it out, whether council permission is needed and the general workload in the area.

For the most part, they are usually pretty fast at resolving blockages but it really depends on the work load in the area and the work required to resolve the blockage. New installations (liked leased circuits) or existing services with a SLA/SLG will take priority for local resources.

I'm not sure about Ceberus' terms, but I believe with OR that you would only be responsible for the work already carried out and the survey if you cancelled now. From the sounds of it, not much work seems to have taken place so far.

On the other hand, it's not clear what the new build costs would be for the new FTTPoD pricing. It's clearly geared towards getting a PON full of subscribers, so I would imagine that the costs would be lower than a single install now.

I wonder what type of criteria they use for premises passed per PON? Set radial distance from new PON perhaps?

Get well soon dude.

If I'm reading that correctly is that the first time Openreach have provided a 12 month contract time for FTTPoD instead of the 36 months it was on all previous orders?

I wonder, if that's the case, if it'll encourage more ISPs to start offering FTTPoD services...

The 12 month contract opens it up to the consumer market. However, a lot of ISPs don't resell the FTTP product itself so not sure if ISPs that don't sell FTTP would go into the FTTPoD market.

The change to minimum contract term could be very interesting as well as (AFAIK) once your FTTPoD minimum has expired it's possible to get a standard FTTP tarriff which is a lot cheaper. So more customers might pay for FTTPoD as a means of getting FTTP access...

I'm going to enquire with FluidOne about my existing order and whether this would affect it as it's currently blocked for an indefinite period of time waiting on a card at the head end exchange...

In reply to a post by raesene:

The change to minimum contract term could be very interesting as well as (AFAIK) once your FTTPoD minimum has expired it's possible to get a standard FTTP tarriff which is a lot cheaper.

My understanding is that the annual rental charges are the same for FTTPoD as native WBC FTTP under the new system.

ISPs may choose to charge more to the end user, but the costs from Openreach are the same.

Update 01/11/2017

The road works for the duct were finished yesterday, nothing exciting so no pictures sorry.

I got call today to confirm Pole should be replaced on the 9th of November.

Update 06/11/2017

I was told that my pole change date has been brought forward. It will now happen tomorrow 7th November

I will try to make a time lapse video of it.

I look forward to this video. Good luck!

Update: 07/11/2017

Telephone pole has been changed. Unfortunately my video of it is rubbish. I thought I rotated the video to capture the entire pole. The editing software decided to crop the top and bottom

Update 9 Nov 2017:

Hi All,

I've had another update. It turns out that OR have completed their test rodding of the full 1km route to my house. Unfortunately it seems they have identified 18 blockages. Yes you read that right 18. It's probably the first time in 40 years that anyone has even looked at these ducts.

I am waiting on an update for an estimated time frame to clear these blockages and to get the fibre to the pole outside my house.

The good news is that separately the team that works on connecting the pole to my house and then running the fibre inside my house are scheduled to perform their work on 15 November.

So at least they are doing things in parallel and I will see some tangible evidence of work being done.

I did meet with some of the engineers from the pole to house team last Friday and they were very friendly and I showed them exactly where I would like the fibre to run.

So now I am at the mercy of the council and the efficiency of the OR contracting teams to manage to clear these blockages and get the fibre to my pole as fast as they can.

On an interesting note the OR engineer told me that the CSP can be fitted inside my house rather than outside which suits me as I have space in my comms cupboard for it. I thought the CSP had to be external.

@Snake it definitely feels like you are going to beat me to your first download on your new fibre line.

As long as you are home to provide access on the day they come to do the OH BFT and blow, then yes it can be indoors.

no worries mate, ill let you know as soon it goes live

Update 10/11/2017

Fibre team is running fibre up the pole and terminating to a DP (I think that's what the block is)

https://gyazo.com/3cc658046c85aa9eb5b43cbb6ac99ac4

https://gyazo.com/a20682cdb7ccdc0e698de4186c9d4b44 (You can see new black box on the left hand side)

I'm quite impressed how your order is progressing. If that is a new connector based fibre DP, will that mean your neighbours could now order standard FTTP?

My understanding is, that my neighbors would still have to pay the same installation charge. It would be a bit annoying for me to pay full whack for the street

In reply to a post by craski:

I'm quite impressed how your order is progressing. If that is a new connector based fibre DP, will that mean your neighbours could now order standard FTTP?

At present subsequent FTTPoD orders are charged at full price. However once Openereach's revised FTTPoD pricing kicks in from Feb 2018, one-off installation costs (single or multiple) will be based on actual work required instead of installation charge bands. So its possible that Snakes' immediate neighbours (and mine for that matter!) would pay significantly less in installation charges now that a FTTP splitter/DP has been installed very close by if they were to order the service next year. But under the new pricing, the neighbour(s) would need to request for a OR survey for which they would have to pay ~ £200 if they decided not to proceed.

Edited by deleted (Fri 10-Nov-17 10:12:48)

In reply to a post by baby_frogmella:

But under the new pricing, the neighbour(s) would need to request for a OR survey for which they would have to pay ~ £200 if they decided not to proceed.

Not forgetting though that an initial estimate would be provided free of charge. As far as I understand it.

In reply to a post by indigobanana:

In reply to a post by baby_frogmella:

But under the new pricing, the neighbour(s) would need to request for a OR survey for which they would have to pay ~ £200 if they decided not to proceed.

Not forgetting though that an initial estimate would be provided free of charge. As far as I understand it.

Are you sure about that? I thought under the new pricing OR would be getting rid of initial estimates (wrt installation costs) and would only give out installation costs after the survey. At present you're given an initial estimate (based on distance band) which is then confirmed or revised after the survey.

In reply to a post by baby_frogmella:

Are you sure about that? I thought under the new pricing OR would be getting rid of initial estimates (wrt installation costs) and would only give out installation costs after the survey. At present you're given an initial estimate (based on distance band) which is then confirmed or revised after the survey.

I think so, unless I read it wrong. Sounds like charge is only if the CP has agreed the initial estimate, proceeded to planning phase and then cancelled the order.

In reference to www.openreach.co.uk/orpg/home/products/pricing/loadProductPriceDeta...:

4) Prices are subject to survey and relevant FTTP on Demand Build charges. We will provide an initial, non-binding estimate of the level of build costs. Upon confirmation by the communications provider, we will proceed with a planning phase, and establish a final firm price for the build costs which is valid for a period of thirty (30) days. At this stage, if the communications provider does not want to proceed with the Order then it is liable to pay the survey and design fee.

Edited by deleted (Fri 10-Nov-17 10:30:13)

Thanks, so it appears under the new pricing you will still be able to get a free estimate of installation costs up front. Let's hope OR don't get snowed under with quotation requests from the Walter Mitty's of this world!

That would be annoying, but out of my control. For the pricing to change where the initial cost was paid by me but I suppose its early adopter issue.

I should add though, the chances of anyone on my street paying for fibre is 0%. unless it comes down £30 a month, no one on the street is interested in paying over that. I am a techie, work in IT industry (work remotely) so have different reasons.

I would say you were a late adopter of a product most of us had been expecting to disappear in the near future. It is some time since BT started suggesting they were reviewing the old FTTPoD pricing model so I think most were waiting to see what they did.

Fair point, but still I signed up for what it was at the time (and currently is) - can't complain about the future

This is probably a dumb question but I will ask it anyway.

If neighbours of us early adopters apply for fibre on demand do they then share the same physical cable that runs all the way to the cabinet or agg node that we paid money to install?

In other words will they use up our bandwidth or do OR run new lines to the telephone pole?

Fibre on Demand is no different to GEA-FTTP - the only differences have been ones to do with the price you pay

Under old FoD pricing it was priced so that you did not pay the full cost, and others ordering would still have to buy a FoD product with probably slightly less pricing than the first person.

Under new FoD pricing, an allowance is made for those the FoD order in theory makes, but anyone else ordering after the FoD customer is live gets access to the standard GEA-FTTP install pricing i.e. no FoD supplement needed.

In terms of bandwidth, go read on how GPON works i.e. 2.5 Gbps shared between a split of users, in the Openreach network that's 32 customers, some other GPON providers use the maximum of 128. Point to point fibre gives you dedicated bandwidth but at a slightly higher install cost and is what Gigaclear use currently.

The CBT/DP on my polenhas 8 ports serve red by a single fibre. Since fibre can do 40GB depending on the connection point on each side, I�m guessing it�s the same fibre. Either way I can�t inagine our bandwidth getting split. That will happen from the exchange onwards

In reply to a post by MrSaffron:

Under new FoD pricing, an allowance is made for those the FoD order in theory makes, but anyone else ordering after the FoD customer is live gets access to the standard GEA-FTTP install pricing i.e. no FoD supplement needed.

I wonder if neighbours would automatically get GEA-FTTP option showing up or they would still have to order FoD without the upfront build cost?